A
male
age
41-50,
anonymous
writes:Hi. I have a situation where I need an objective opinion before I act with too much haste and ruin everything.I have been with my fiancée for a little over two years now and I thought everything was going great up until about a week ago. She has been friends with an older gentleman (he's about 15 years older than her) for a long time (she knew him before she met me)and frankly, I never really gave him a second thought until I caught her lying about seeing him.Here's what initially happened: She was sitting next to me on the couch and her phone rang. So she looked at it and said quickly "stupid telemarketers" and turned the phone face down. Well, the problem is, I saw that it was her friend before she flipped the phone over. I didn't know what to make of this so the next day, I confronted her about it. She made up the excuse that she didn't feel like talking to him and she's not sure why she said what she said. She also said she hardly ever talks to him lately and hasn't seen him in months.It seemed a little weird to me so that night, I took a look at the call log on the cell carrier's website. Not only had she called him back the same night she pretended he was a telemarketer but she had called him 5 times the next day. At this point, I'm really starting to get upset - so I confronted her again. Only this time, instead of asking about the phone call, something in my gut told me to ask "What did you do yesterday?" She flipped out accusing me of following her and violating her privacy - she had been to see him at his hotel (he lives a few hundred miles away) that afternoon - the SAME day that she was telling me she hardly ever talks to him. So then she says she'll come clean - according to her, the reason she lied to me about it was that her best friend is dating this guy and she's been sort of playing match maker. The friend had asked her not to say anything to me because she was embarrassed and has kids that she doesn't want finding out.Well...something about this explanation stinks to me. I don't know what it is, but the more I think about it, the more I feel like this is just another lie. For one thing, I did a little research and found out he's been coming to see her once or twice a month for the ENITRE time we've been together (in fact, he's coming to see her again this coming week).So this brings us to confrontation number three which happened last night... I told her I don't trust her any more and that I think something is going on between her and this guy. She got FURIOUS - she said this man is like a second father to her and how dare I accuse her of having an affair with him. So now, if you're keeping track, he's going from someone she never talks to - to a second father that she talks to all the time. She said she absolutely spends time with him every time he comes to see her. I said "Fine. If he's that important to you, would you please invite him to our house for dinner so that I can meet him?" Her answer was "F*** you. The only reason you want to meet him is so you can accuse us of stuff. You're not meeting him. Period." I said "Does he even know you're engaged?" Instead of answering, she responded with "What difference does it make if he knows? I've known him for longer than I've known you. I'm going to continue to be his friend because I'm not doing anything wrong and if you can't live with that, then pack your stuff and get out."I know she was angry and probably didn't mean things as harshly as they came out... But everything in my body is screaming that there is something going on that she's not telling me. Maybe she's not having a physical relationship with him but she's not telling me the truth either - I feel it in my heart that the whole "best friend" story is just more lies (although she is sticking to it completely).... I don't know what to do. She's pointed out that she's the one that suggested we move in together. She's the one that's letting her daughter call me daddy. She's the one that took the steps to make us more serious and why would she do that if she wanted to keep seeing other guys. Which, to be honest, are all very good points - but why won't she let me meet this friend that's apparently so important to her life? Why does she lie about seeing him? Why does she have to meet him in a hotel room instead of bringing him by our house?All I know is, I'm driving myself crazy over this - I spent last night being angry for a few hours, crushed for a few hours and then looking for an apartment for a couple hours. I love this woman and her daughter more than I've ever loved anyone or anything in my life but I can't marry someone that I don't trust and she doesn't seem the least bit interested in earning any trust back even though she admits she was wrong about lying to me...What do you thing? Am I overreacting and being a paranoid jealous person? I've been cheated on in the past and I'm afraid that sometimes I look for problems where they don't exist - but the last week (since the first "missed" phone call) have been so many red flags that I've lost count. I don't want to lose her - but I know myself well enough to know I can't just look the other way while she continues to meet with this guy every couple of weeks....Help!
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male
reader, deerhunter +, writes (4 November 2013):
Dear friend, I have so many responses but Ill stick to 2 for now...1. Most pathological liars and personality-challenged individuals will explode on you when you call them out on their dishonesty. That is a well-known method of ensuring THAT conversation does not happen. She is manipulating you and playing you like a violin.2. She has no intention of ever being honest with you, anyone else, or herself. That phone call and the initial cover up was only the beginning of a lifetime of deceit if you stick with her. I had The...Exact....Same... Thing happen to me. A late night text, a lie about who it was, obfuscation about what the caller's intentions were, attempts to bully and intimidate me from further inquiries, and ultimately a cheating girlfriend. (Oh yes, by the way, when she is eventually revealed to be lying about everything, it will of course be YOUR fault).This meeting she's allegedly orchestrating? Either it will not happen or it will be pre scripted for her benefit. Do not agree to it. Get out, and let her find some other sucker to take care of her kid. I'm sorry, but I think this is over. Good luck.
A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (4 November 2013): I think you're being played. There's obviously more to this than meets the eye. My ex was just like this. She was the one always pushing to move the relationship on. She wanted us to move in together, get married and have kids. All the time she was seeing another man. When I confronted her she went through several versions of her story. Initially the other bloke was a weird bloke who'd tried to sleep with her on a night out and she'd told him where to go. Then his explicit texts were evidence that she was keeping if she ever reported him to the police. Then he was a friend, but nothing ever happened between them. I finally called it a day when I found out that she was arranging to see him for sex one weekend. Another word of advice, her best female friend knew all about it and was happy to help out with her lies.I'd go with your gut and call a halt to everything. Move out and have some time to yourself to think about what you want. Once trust has gone it's very difficult to rebuild.
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A
female
reader, So_Very_Confused +, writes (4 November 2013):
 I read as far as her second "got furious" and I know all I need to know..
she's LYING to you... there is WAY more going on that friends and she's getting angry as a defense move to throw you off track.
you are NOT over reacting
you are not paranoid
you are not overly jealous
I was married to a liar like this... note i WAS married to him...
dump her... but be prepared for her to try to keep you.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (4 November 2013): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionThank you all for your replies. I guess there's been an update since I posted the original question. We had another fight about this late yesterday...
She asked me why I was being so standoffish this weekend and I told her because I don't see our future any longer. She asked why and I said "because I don't trust you any more..."
Initially she got angry again and we started down the road that I've already documented in the original post but then things changed. She got really quiet and started crying. She said "Do you believe I love you?" I said "Well, I did...now I'm not sure." She said "What do you want me to do? Do you want me to never speak to him again? The relationship between me and him is NOT what you think it is - but if it means losing you over it, I won't talk to him again."
I told her that it doesn't matter to me what the relationship is - when she started lying about it, it destroyed the trust. I told her I don't believe she's told him we're engaged (she now says that yes she has), I don't believe the "matchmaker" thing and I don't believe that there isn't more to the story. She just shook her head and said "Ok. If I ask him to come here to the house and have dinner with us the next time he's in town, will that fix things?" I said "Fix things? I don't know...but it's a start. When's he coming to town again?" She said "I don't have an exact date, but soon. I'll ask him to come. I'll also ask my friend (the one she supposedly played matchmaker for) to come and you can ask them both whatever you want to ask them...."
So I guess I'm going to wait and see how this transpires... I still love her and her daughter and if we can work this out, I want to. But I'm done with the lies... One more lie about any of this and I'll be seeing how much I can re-sell the engagement ring for...
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (4 November 2013): She is hiding, she is keeping secrets and she is getting defensive and trying to turn the tables on you. There is something going on with this guy. Your insticts are right. Do NOT let this go and accept her answers. She is making them up as she goes along. The question is why?If she was on the up and up, she would not be doing and saying all of those things. If it really was just a friend, he would be a part of your lives together, not keeping him at bay. Her points are crap and pure manipulation to get herself out of being busted. She has done all those things in your relationship for security, but she is far from ready to be in a committed relationship with only one person. She's holding onto this "friend" for some reason. None of this is fair to you and not something you deserve or should have in a relationship.I have a few guy friends that I've had know for a really, really long time and my fiance has met every one of them. We have all spent time together, we stayed at one of the guys condo when we were visiting one year. My fiance knows and has seen our relationship first hand and these guys are no threat to him because I have had nothing to hide. I too get random texts from them on occasion and never have I made up a story like that, I just say who it is, again because I have nothing to hide.If this guy is who she says he is, then she too would not behaving the way she is. She's going off the deap end over you confronting her because she is trying not to choke on all the guilty pie she is eating. As much as we would like to give our partners the benefit of the doubt, make sure you take off your rose colored glasses. There IS something going on that she is not telling you and personally, if this was me, I would be putting a halt on any future plans with this person. If there are so many secrets and things she's keeping from you, you are already on rocking ground. It doesn't make for a solid, trusting relationship that can grow.I think you should show her all these responses...you have a lot of back up. But just the same, I am sorry she is doing this to you and your relationship. But better to find out now then after you got married.
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A
female
reader, Anonymous 123  +, writes (4 November 2013):
 2nd father? Seriously? From a guy she never talks to, to being a 2nd father, who by the way, has never even bothered to initiate any contact with his "daughter's" fiance. Wow!! If there ever was an episode of cheating and bad lies, this is it, OP. And she's been playing match maker for her "father"? Classy!!
This story is peppered with loopholes and red flags and now its up to you to see them and act accordingly. And I agree with CincyCares, you seem to be a nice guy who's genuinely fond of this woman and accepting of her child and this she knows is hard, if not impossible to find. Why would a single man without any baggage want to start his life with a woman who already has a child? Not many people would want to do that and you OP are a catch to her.
She's the one that suggested you move in together.
She's the one that's letting her daughter call you daddy.
She's the one that took the steps to make your relationship more serious.
Why would she do that if she wanted to keep seeing other guys? Because YOU are the safety net OP and her best bet. She knows that if she can get a commitment out of you then she has you right where she wants. She has a daddy for her daughter, she has a place to live in and you're happy because she's the one who initiated this "commitment" chain.
Why she chooses to get involved with the older man is only for her to know. Maybe she's sexually more attracted to him, maybe she feels "sparks" with him, maybe she shares that something with you which she cant share with you, maybe she's mentally and emotionally more compatible with him... maybe maybe maybe. We can just guess but the fact is that something is very wrong here and don't allow yourself to get used in this game anymore.
Why don't you ask her and her daughter to move out? Now that your girlfriend has another father, having a place to stay shouldn't be a problem. DON'T allow yourself to get emotionally manipulated by the fact that you are like a 'daddy' to her daughter. You aren't.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (4 November 2013): My opinion is a such. You can be officially called the second fiddle. You just told everybody about your gut instincts and my friend they are right on. Tell This woman that the marriage is off and that she can go and join this other friend she has known longer than you permanently. You do not need this kind of B.S. from her. There is something wrong here. If she loves you she would have no problem in having him over for dinner to meet you. Better still go ahead with this farce or wedding coming up and hire a private investigator and find out what is really going on. Once you have the answers and you probably know it wont be good just text her and tell her you have something important for her to read on the table when she gets home then go pack your bags and get the hell out of Dodge. And please get yourself checked for any sexually transmitted goodies she may of brought from that person she has known longer than you. All the best on this. You know what you have to do. Stop the heartache and stop the pain now......
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A
male
reader, CMMP +, writes (4 November 2013):
Well she's definitely full of shit and she's definitely hiding something. I can only guess what it is, but it really doesn't matter do you really want to risk your future on a liar? Not only a liar but one that thinks that you should be okay with her lying and automatically trust her despite it.
It's remotely possible that she's lying because she doesn't want to have to explain herself. But you are definitely owed an explanation. Also, going to see a guy and meeting him in a hotel (secretly) is NEVER okay.
If I was you I'd probably not be able to continue the relationship any more. At this point I think you know too much. It's not so much what she did, it's who she is that would make me end things.
Marriages end all the time because people ignore warnings like these... She even gave you the best excuse in the world: if you don't like it then pack your bags. Well, pack your bags!
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (4 November 2013): Yes its strange. How would she like it if you were doing the same. Im like you, I couldnt put up with that no chance. This is not normal at all. I would leave because it would just play on my mind and I would just end up hating the person then. Just leave, because at least your mind will be at rest. Shes in the wrong, you dont behave like that when you are in love..
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (3 November 2013): Short and sweet: EVERYTHING about this smells like her cheating. It's absolutely textbook. Tell her that if she's not cheating, then she at least needs to accept the fact that she has given your common sense a boatload of reasons to think she is. The burden of proof is on her to convince you otherwise. This is not just your opinion, this would be the opinion of 10 out of 10 random people off the street in your shoes. The fact that she has escalated the relationship with you says nothing about whether or not she has been having an affair the whole time. Saying, "Why would she do all that if she wanted to date us both" is like saying "Why would that guy walk out of the store with two Televisions if he only wanted to pay for one of them?" It only doesn't make sense if you are viewing it as an honest person. Face it, she's cheating. I'm sorry but this looks pretty clear cut. It is probably all over but the moving out and crying.
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A
female
reader, CindyCares +, writes (3 November 2013):
 I',m sorry but I share Honeypie's opinion, and if I had to gurss , my guess would be just like hers.
As for why ,if your fiancee' meant keeping seeing another guy , she would have asked you to move in, let her daughter call you daddy, etc...- ah well, because in general men aren't exactly tripping all over themselves for going to marry a single mother as your fiancee' is. It may be wrong,prejudiced, selfish etc.etc.- the fact is that most men are not keen on taking on a ready -made family , they'd rather start their own from scratch- and single mothers DO have less long term partnering options than single childless girls.
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A
female
reader, Honeypie + ♥, writes (3 November 2013):
 Honestly, I don't blame how you feel. EVEN if I do find it really underhanded how you are gathering all your Intel on her and him.
TO BE FRANK - I think she is full of BULL SHOT.
IF he is THAT important to her, second "daddy" he would KNOW she was engaged and he would WANT to met you too.
EVERY TIME you question her (or confront) SHE turns it back on you. Again, if it really was innocent she would be honest and leave you with little or no doubt.
So, let's look at the progression.
1. he calls and she don't want to talk to him in front of you (AKA darn telemarketers) RED FLAG. If he is just a friend talking to him in front of you should be NO BIGGIE.
2. She LIES about it. RED FLAG. But so badly that you investigate.
3. When confronted she attacks your actions. RED FLAG. While there were not coming from a trusting and loving place, you kind of had to follow your gut instinct that said something was fishy.
4. The she makes up this UNBELIEVABLE STUPID story about being a match maker. And of course this has to be a TOTAL secret (as in you can't even ASK the chick without making this chick feel bad). RED flag. Again you followed you nose and saw that he comes to visit once a month. RED FLAG.
5. She doesn't want you to met him. RED FLAG - Notice that the reason she gives is because YOU would act inappropriate towards him & her.
6. He doesn't know about the engagement. RED FLAG. Even if he was a casual friend he would know about it.
Admitting she lied is not really hard, specially since she got caught in her bad lies. By saying I'm sorry I lied that was bad of me. She IS NOT saying her ACTIONS are bad, nor does she tell you the truth. She is doing the BASIC minimum to STOP you questioning her.
If you live together I suggest (if you live with her I should say) you need to find your own place, and you need to move out. Get the ring back, cancel the engagement. Once IF you two can sort it out you can propose again.
Then SIT down and figure out what you need from her to let her EARN your trust back. And what she NEEDS from you. If you two can't/won't do that for each other, I'm afraid you are BOTH wasting your time.
I would ask to met him. I would be polite and nice and watch him/her like a hawk. IF she can't/won't do that - that would be it for me.
Personally, I would cut my losses however hard it is. My guess is he is her "sugar daddy" thing, he doesn't know about you, he is married and get a little "young" on the side. But again, I'm ONLY guessing.
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A
male
reader, Overlay +, writes (3 November 2013):
I would have trouble accepting her explanation, also. Maybe a female can offer a plausible rationale for your fiancée's behavior, but, to my male eyes, there is (or has been) something illicit going on. If there weren't, there wouldn't be the lying, and, especially, the anger and defensiveness in response to your asking her, "What did you do yesterday?" (reacting as if she suspected that you had knowledge of her activities), or to your suggestion about wanting to meet this man. I'd be naturally inclined to hesitate before just throwing two years away, but, to me, she has to at least give you the truth about the situation so that you can make an informed judgment about whether it's something that you can work through together, or whether there's been a serious breach of trust that she either doesn't (or won't) recognize, or else doesn't see the need to address. It would surprise and sadden me if a woman with a child's welfare to consider would engage in this kind of behavior (especially since she had previously taken the positive steps that you indicate with regard to your relationship), but that's my personal opinion, based on your version of events.
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