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*indyCares
writes: I guess my question is more for the men on DC, but of course I am also interested in women's comments. So : it seems the general consensus , at least among the younger generations, is that a woman SHOULD be hairless down there :the hairless the better. And I took this as coming from porn and the specific sanitized ,airbrushed images that people are currently fed all the time.. It turns out this is not such a new, current thing. Yesterday I was reading " Desperate Romantics " ( which the UK readers ,I think, know well because a very popular TV series was based on it few years ago ) . It says that art critic and painter John Ruskin married at age 29 but was adamant in refusing to have sex with his wife . ( Actually he told her that at 19 she was too young for that stuff and they were going to do it when she was 25 . Her 25 th birthday came and went with no changes, and the poor lady ended with asking for an annullment ). This was a bit of a mistery for the historians and the gossipmongers of the time, who had got wind there was something off in this marriage - because Ruskin , as far as it's known, was not gay, was not impotent, was not sick, and was not MORE neurotic than you'd expect from an artist :). The WIFE eventually gave the explanation of the mistery in a private letter to her father, in which she admits that , in seeing her naked, Ruskin was shocked, dismayed and disgusted. He had never seen a real nude woman before ( it figures, after all this happened under Queen Victoria )- only classic paintings and drawings and... he had not expected THAT. Which he found very unappealing. So unappealing that he declined to partake.Well, apparently nowadays too, some ( many ? ) guys feel the same - at least, they feel they'd rather not to deal with a real life vagina, if they can avoid that. They turn down live women in favour of porn, and anyway , for the real woman to be desirable .... she has to be a fake woman ( bleached anus and all ). I am curious to know ( and tryng to be the least crude that's possible ),OK ,but what is it exactly that you find strange and unpleasant ? The fur, the " design " per se ? The humidity and secretions ? The natural odour ?....And, girls, how come in general you do not feel the same, you can deal serenely with unshaven groins ?...
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reader, anonymous, writes (26 March 2015): Wow they all expect you to be shaved? As a married woman I wasn't sure but this only confirms how men are all totally Brainwashed by porn . Why are women playing into this and giving them what they want
Just because we live in this world where women are over sexualised ?
Fair enough if a woman WANTs to shave but over and over I read of woman complaining of painful waxing and spots caused by shaving all because men want this . Are men truly such drones that they just feed off
Porn and are women really so Desperate fot mens attention that we will sacrifice our own desires to be how we want?
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female
reader, anonymous, writes (26 March 2015): I don't know about aesthetics etc. for all men but in my experience,they do all prefer it that way. I have so far been directly asked: "Why do you not shave down there?" by a guy,which got a reply of "Coz I'm not a porn star.",so yeah he was fairly surprised, not disgusted or anything just genuinely surprised and seemed to have never encountered that before in his experience (both in our 20s).With a long-term ex, he point blank refused to give me oral unless it was baby-like shaved (i.e. no hair whatsoever). I could not do that (shaving is actually painful to me-the shaved area always gets extremely red and well,I'm not gonna get graphic but it's an ugly business.) Waxing works with less problems but is such a high level of Chinese-style torture that in the end the pleasure from oral does not justify the pain of waxing...Btw, I don't think it was hypocritical on his part or anything,as he was always shaven down there himself (and I really don't know how he got the area so smooth!As in not a single hair and no irritated skin whatsoever!)He did like it that way,so I guess he just expected that from me too. He did let it grow for a bit "in protest" I think, but as it did not phase me or put me off him in any way (and I did not make any comments on it) he just let it go (though sadly, still no fun for me :P ). And then he reverted back to his own "shave everything off" standard and never came back from it.I guess I'll just have to keep finding men who are "dinosaurs" or have that same view :PI'm getting that reaction of surprise or whatever but tbf,I do not want to change myself to please someone else (especially when that change is painful in my case), so I'll just have to find someone who will take me as I am.Ultimately,I've come to realise and experience that if a man really wants to please you, a bit of hair won't stop him.
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female
reader, Tisha-1  +, writes (25 March 2015):
 Hi, Cindy, I'm a bit late to this question, but I have to add my 2000 liras worth.... yes, that makes me a dinosaur or veteran as you so nicely put it....
I get ingrown hairs with large pimply pustules if I get too aggressive in the hair removal department. So gentle treatment and trimming is the best for me.
As for my DH, he is gorgeously masculine and I would not ask him to remove one hair off his splendid person.
I am from an era when Playboy was something shocking and I think we've lost a bit of the mystery and fun... now there are performers willing to look like prepubescent children.... not my thing. I've changed a few diapers in my day and hairless is kind of ooky.
I guess the current trend is to be hairless and oddly synthetic (such as the Kardashian women with their oddly unnatural bottoms). But that too shall change.
Just keep in mind that those trendy hipster beards which are all the rage now will soon just go back into the fashion vault as another trend....
I'm just happy to be part of the era where you didn't have to rip every hair from your body... OUCH!
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reader, anonymous, writes (24 March 2015):
I am a man and I like women, not girls. A nice trim is good, but hairless is just weird to me.
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female
reader, CindyCares +, writes (23 March 2015):
CindyCares is verified as being by the original poster of the question Thanks everybody so far for answering ( and in case one should think I am sanguine about the hair/ no hair issue- actually I am not, this is such a personal thing that, basically, hey whatever works individually ).
A special mention to C.Grant ,whom I prefer to call, rather than a " dynosaur "...maybe a veteran ?, and we all know that veterans are brave by definition. So no wonder ,C.Grant, that , when duty should call,....you'd be brave enough to, ahem,... stare straight in the face of danger whatever shape and form it may take :)
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reader, Honeypie + ♥, writes (23 March 2015):
 History of shaving goes back at LEAST 3-4,000 years. So it's not something totally brand spanking new.
The Norse (Vikings) (men and women) carried a little purse with personal grooming stuff, comb, razor, toothpick - they used lye to clean their hair (my guess is mainly the hair on the head) to avoid lice. Shaving BELOW might have been to avoid lice/fleas below.
Ancient Greece, the riches part of society shaved, my guess is they were the only one having the time for that. Someone who works from sun up to sun down isn't so worried about body hairs. BUT it was more for MEN than women - after all it was men who ran around naked to be admired.
Muslims are BIG on hair removal, even IF no one is there to see it. It part of their religion.
If you look in art, pubic hair is NOT there (at least NOT on women) Take a look at Ruben's lovely ladies.. not a single follicle. Michelangelo's David DOES have pubic hairs, but his men on the Sistine Chapel do not. Sculptures of women do not either.
With the 1960's full bush made a comeback. It was all about BEING who you are, loving who you are. But funny enough the bikini introduced the "bikini wax or shave" and trim.
It's been more hairless from the 1970's and onward.
Some people call it aesthetic. Some don't.
I think a guy totally shaven looks like a flipping naked mole-rat - I don't find that aesthetic pleasing at all. No, nicely trimmed and groomed is good (for me). I have been told that some guys shave because they think it makes them look bigger (longer) so THAT doesn't surprise me. Always reminds me of Zohan and his dead bird in a nest...
For a woman I don't think it all needs to come off, but it does make it a little easier around menstruation with a waxed front or at least very trimmed. I don't think a shaved female looks more aesthetically pleasing either. And then add razor curts and ingrown hairs? YUCK
Some people ALSO assume it's more hygienic - well, studies have shown that that isn't the case. STD's are actually EASIER to transmit with someone who waxes and shaves - as they can have tiny cut and wide-open follicles. HPV for example spreads through skin contact, so it's not like you can "just" use condoms.... For a couple of hundred years people also thought removing the foreskin on a man's penis is more hygienic...
I also don't have a problem with male leg hair, it's fine, EXCEPT if he shaves his armpits, then he needs to go all the way and shave the legs too - or he ends up looking like Ken doll meets Sasquatch. Chest hairs? I actually find that VERY manly. BACK HAIR though... gross on anyone.
I also do not have a problem with male facial hairs AS LONG as it's neat, not full of holes and hairs going everywhere. You CAN (as a male) look neat with facial hair, but not all men CAN carry that look.
However, what YOU personally like FOR YOURSELF is fine with me, shaven or full bush - but WHEN YOU (general you) tells a WOMAN or MAN that THEY have to do AS you do to be considered attractive, then you are DOING it wrong.
Do as YOU please! IF a dude/dudette doesn't like it - oh well THEY aren't getting laid then, are they?
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reader, jls022  +, writes (23 March 2015):
Personally, I think that neatly trimmed is best. Contrary to what the male anon said, shaving is problematic to me as it results in ingrown hairs every time no matter what I do. I actually asked my doctor about it as a couple got infected (sorry for the over share!) and she said some people are just prone to them.
No man I have ever been with has complained, but if he did I'd make a deal with him. As long as he shaves every inch of his body, then I will too!
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reader, Sageoldguy1465 +, writes (23 March 2015):
 Cindy: I think pubic hair is similar as cranial hair.... insofar as it can be most anything.... bald, colored, full... whatever....
If two people are sexually intimate and will discuss such matters, then they can find both their preferences and play to them....
I wouldn't put much concern in to what "the conscensus" is..
since this is TRULY a matter of personal preferences, only.
My point of view? (Clean) hygiene and an openness about sexual details is something that two people who are engaging in intimate behaviour can decide for themselves...
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reader, C. Grant  +, writes (23 March 2015):
 Cindy you already know that I'm a dinosaur, so I'm not the target audience for your question. I don't like grooming down there. Basic hygiene, of course. But otherwise I love how mother nature offers it up. And having changed many, many diapers, I can't get past a nagging sense of "pedo" in the current bare style. So bush or forest, it's all great with me.
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reader, So_Very_Confused +, writes (23 March 2015):
 I can tell you when I met my now husband he shaved. I put a stop to that.
Personally I don't find the clean shaven look appealing in men or women... trimmed is lovely... shave the shaft by all means but leave the boys and the base with some manly hair.
so while the MALE OP says it's aesthetics he is speaking for himself.
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reader, CindyCares +, writes (23 March 2015):
CindyCares is verified as being by the original poster of the question Really, it's not that hard or problematic to shave.
.... Then why just a small minority of MEN regularly shave their pubes, or their chest, or their legs OR their armpits (...and shaving these , it would be a great idea !...)
Has clean look aesthetic appeal for males only ?
If so, why ?
Anon male, thank you for your concern about my mental sanity, but, for the time being, it is still safely in place and not at big risk :). I am just killing time, shooting the breeze, AND curious to find what's the logic behind the aesthetics - generally there's always one, ( cultural, social, biological... ) Perhaps even in grooming aesthetics, who knows...
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reader, anonymous, writes (23 March 2015): Clean look has aesthetic appeal. Nothing to do with "fake" or "disliking natual odour", just everyone like "clean stuff". Imagine anything you find attractive, and now imagine it in hair all over the place. Yep.
Don't dig it too deep, it is a bad sign to look for hidden ideas where there are none, you've already gone a little over the top of crazy with this thing.
It is actually not that hard or problematic to shave. People do that with face all the time, noone has to analyse this behaviour, have we?
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