A
male
age
36-40,
anonymous
writes:I'm pretty screwed up right now...Essentially my girlfriend of over 7 years slept with her best friend about 6 months ago, once drunk in the night, and again in the morning (though she claims se was still drunk).I've always suspected it. she visited for about 4 days after we had a holiday which was really romantic and sweet and good for us. During the holiday we talked about children and marriage and stuff and i joked that i wouldn't marry her (i was planning engagement and had asked her dad already).When she came back i knew something was up. i pressed, and she later said that he'd told her he loved her and didnt want to tell me til he'd broken up with his own girlfriend as knew I might spill the beans (which was fair enough) she assured me that she didn't feel the same and that nothing happened. Things were still a little wiered. i sensed she was preoccupied with something and pressed again which led to a string of fights. I then later read som messages where it transpired that shed considered leaving me for him but said that she wanted to try with me first. I went crazy. turned a hotel room upside down as i felt so decieved, but after i calmed i was happy that i was chosen and although shed lied, we had been fighting so i could understand why she might be drawn to someone declaring their love for her. I agreed that they could talk about xmas time and a month later i proposed and she accepted. we were fantastic and the relationship was probably the best its ever been (since the fisrt few months which are obviously always OTT). tho she was still reserved intimately, which isn't that unusual she's never had a crazy sex drive. 3 days ago rumors were flying she had cheated and i got a call from one of her friends asking me if i knew. i didnt and i confronted her directly again assuring her that if she told me i could forgive her (or would be much more likely to). i said i wanted a fresh start and to put this to bed and we couldnt have a future that was based around lies and she couldnt live in fear if find out. she told me she had a clear conscience and i accepted that. however, two days ago the guy admitted it to his girlfriend who then told me. I confronted my girlfriend again and she told me that he was making it up because he hates her (they fell out when she stopped speaking to him originally and when i said they could speak he didn't really bother). obisouly i didn't buy this so pressed her hard, i was pretty rude and accusation and eventually, after a few half confessions which ended up in her blaming me for making her feel so low, she admitted to cheating. she told me it was a drunken thing that happened before she had time to come to terms with it and she didnt enjoy it, it was awkward afterwards and the next day they hardly spoke and she came home. now obviously i wasn't happy. and i left the house before coming home and sleeping on he sofa when she was in bed. since it was a drunken mistake and it happened so long ago i kind of got over it. id always known it really as her personality changed so much w hen she came back and i was relieved we both could stop worrying about it. or so i thought.yesterday the guy wote to me to apologise and said i deserved honesty. so i asked some questions and he answered them. he told me that it just happened and they never planned it and that nothing had happened before and that it happened again in the morning when she came on to him....What twice! I confronted her again, and she denied, again saying we needed to drop it and that he hated her. but again after a lot of pushing and stuff she told me that it happened twice and insisted that she didnt instigate it in the morning (which is what he said happened) she told me that it meant nothing and then went on a rant about how he was there for her and made her feel loved (im a professioanl poker player, and I'd been putting a ton of hours in writing and playing, working mega hard before she left as we had huge bills from her university so i coudlnt give her much time for a while before). She said that eh came on to her in the morning and she went with it because she thought, 'why not' she'd already made the mistake she may aswell feel better about herself (she also insisted that she was still drunk at this stage)She said she never told me because she loved me and wanted to be with me and cried all the way home from his. she said that she didnt want to lose her best friend and me and tried to keep us both happy, but kept getting herself deeper and deeper and couldnt admit it as she knew id never look at her the same way. regardless, she made me feel awful for months about not letting them speak and accusing her of infidelity and it totally ruined me, I had a bit of a break down and was on antidepressants for a while.she say this and was pretty cold during it.we moved into a place in august agreeing a fresh start (this was before i knew but after it happened, and this is when things began to imporve between us. she always had this sadness about her, like she was preoccupied and now i know why. around december things were so good that i proposed , committing to us 100%. she accepted and i was delighted. and it was awesome until all this a few days ago. i felt that we'd emerged stronger because of everything and that almost losing her showed me how much she meant to me... obviusly i thought nearly losing her was my fault for accusing her and neglecting her a bit tho. She said she felt lonely which is why it happened as she felt i was ignoring her and james showed her attention and she thought he loved her. she's assured me that she loves me and wants to be with me, but this has set us back to a point where I don't know if i can forgive her. Honestly, ive done everything i could for her. i thought it was all my fault and i waned to fix it. or i thought i was. i made sure she wanted for nothing and never hit or bossed her around, or disrespected her. But i don't know if we can continue. I've said ill agree to give her another chance because there's never been anyone else for me while we've been together, and i love her and insane amount, but its hard, obviously i cant stop thinking about them. i have no doubt that this was the only time she has cheated, the change in her poersonality which i assume is down to guilt tells me this. One drunken mistake i think i could handle, but she did it one two occasions, once probably sober, and the biggest blow is that she instigated it herself, without a thought of me crossing her mind and i don't see how i can deal with it. she watched me have a break down and didnt tell me (apparently because she knew it would make it worse) but she never really acted with any remorse or massive desire to make up for what shed done, even though i never knew about it. she doesnt want to talk about it any more and wants to forget it or move on she said she thinks we should break up as shes ruined it, and i said that i will try to forgive her and have a fresh start. So i don't know what to do. what she did is surely unforgivable, but i love her and we've been so strong for the past 3 months or so. is twice in one night the same as once in one night?! surely not. surely the relisation of the deed would set in in the first instance right? The only thing that might save us is how good we've been. a week ago i was the happiest i think i'd ever been. this has really taken the wind out of my sails. How can you deal with this, and do you think there's a chance?
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female
reader, anonymous, writes (14 March 2015): I am going to carefully select one of the best moments and happiest times I can recall with her (still working on which one) and I'm going to agree that we both use it when we have a shitty thought or whatever to remind us of what were aiming for. And I'm going to as that fantastic anon post suggests, going to use it until the day we can say I'm glad it happened because it has made us stronger. Yeah thinking of sex is prob a way a way. I guess that will just happen if and when we reconnect. Inwent out last night and as painful as it was I had no urge to get even which I'm glad of. Ironically enough, ingot straight into town and bumped into the other guys ex girlfriend. She gave me a two mintire I deserve better speech, and mesaaged me later in the night which I assume was for some revenge asex, but that's not me and I didn't entertain it. It was just bizzarw because I haven't seen her for years
A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (14 March 2015): Woah,woah,woah!Hold your horses! You've not really gone through any recovery process and you're already asking about how to approach sex with her?WTF???That is the last thing you need to worry about right now.If you want to go down the "let's have another try" road, then engagement is off till you figure out whether you can get over this TOGETHER or not.That means YOU need to figure out what you need from her and she needs to figure out if she can go through with it all.I liked the female anon's post because it could be controlling etc. BUT that's what she needed to get over it and she showed that it declined over time and trust was slowly growing up back again. Almost like a flower growing out of the ashes. Don't know if it will work for her, but I wish her the best and I hope that it does.And that's the point-when trust is shattered to pieces, you either need to glue it back together, painfully piece by piece or you leave the shattered pieces on the floor and deal with how they affect the mirror of your life.WiseOwl is right, if you are too demanding a partner can leave, but then again, they can leave any time they like for whatever reason they fancy. Nothing is guaranteed in life.So you need to figure out what you need from her and set the ground rules.Then you need to be prepared for a SLOW and Painful road ahead for the both of you-there is no easy way out of this mess.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (13 March 2015): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionok so ive given it lots of thought. i know the girl well, very well. my take on it is at the time, especially since i didnt seem bothered and said i wasnt going to marry her, that she was kind of done with the relationship. we werent happy ill admit that. i did neglect her needs. no we neglected each others'.
I dont think she intended to cheat. shes not that kind ofperson she simply would have broke up with me before. i think she was simply overwhelemed by this guys full on attention and when she cheatad, she had already planned on leaving me. lok at her options, someone who didnt seem to care, and someone who adored her.. and he did. i think he always will.
i think during the aftermath she got confused. when she came home one of the first things i said to her was i wanted us to get better. and i blah blah and how much i lvoed her and wanted to fix things.
i think this is where the confusion started. i think it was always me, and she said it was always me and thats why she decided to stay with me. as many have said, she could have left, not just for me, for anyone. shes outstandingly attractive doctor... shes a catch. she gets lots of attention.
i think that she was in a position wheere shetried to save her friendship and herrelationship simulatenously and couldnt do that being honest to either of us. if she wanted him, she tells me and i lave and theyre together... simple... so she told him she wants me and tried to let him down 'gently' as she said.
i thnk shes been really depressed. she has changed and i can see why. i understand why she cheated, and iunderstand that we werent solid enough to withstand this guys approach.... becaus eof us. i know she never cheated ebefore.
i dint think she was sorry, but i really now think she is. since it happened shes seemed really depressed and i assuemd it was with work. now i know what i was.
i geninly do think she wants to be with me and we have been so good since she kicked him to tough. i dont think it was intentional cheating in the sense it was only ever going to be for one night. i think she genuinly planned on leaving me for this guy at the time. and again i undestand why. im not agreeing with her behaviour. just appling how i know she thinks to it.
she agrred to marry me, this is proof enough that she wants to be with me. it was the first time i saw her so happy since it happened. i think the past 9 months have been tainted with regret and the past couple of days ive seen that in her.
the quesion is can i forgive it. can i get the image of htose two out of my mind. shes been honest and has tod me exactly what happened, that she enjoyed it but she loved the attention rather than him. thas the quesion. can i get over the mental pictures and stop tourturing myself.
i think the bigges obvticle will be reconnecting. any suggestions on this obviously if i was to kiss her or sleep with her, the two of them might come to mind. how do i over come this.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (13 March 2015): If you do re-read the anon-female's post, be sure you know how to forgive.
All that stuff with checking his e-mail and demanding your mate to check-in with you like someone on parole or probation can be wearing, demeaning, and too much pressure on your mate. They just may opt out on their own and tell you go screw yourself. I would, if someone is going to treat me like a criminal. I'd rather be dumped!
She's right in saying no one knows but you and her; but you also need an outside opinion. That is because we are often blinded by our fears and confused by our feelings. We "think" we are forgiving; but we are punishing that person in passive-aggressive ways. It may be blissful for her, but very trying for her boyfriend. He may eventually decide he has had enough.
Forgiveness is a very difficult thing to do. I put a lot of emphasis in my advice to you on that. I know that love may be the reason you hold on; but sometimes repressed resentment overrules your sense of empathy for the person who betrayed you. I still want to remind you that if you forgive her, that it is not loaded with restrictions like you're her parole-officer.
She has to make the effort to rebuilt your trust without you enforcing your will on her to do so. This is my last comment.
Good luck!
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (13 March 2015): Op,I'd re-read the other anon female's post a couple of times if I were you.I actually believe (as a woman) that if she wanted to leave you, she could have simply have done so then and there (when it happened). Maybe not told you that she cheated (as that is more merciful when you decide to break up,why rub extra salt in the wound?) but she could have left.She decided not to then for whatever reasons.You have to determine those reasons yourself-was it because she loved you? was it because she wanted to see where it goes even against all the problems you had at the time? was it financial? was it the long time you spent together (shared history and attachment etc)?You both have to figure out what you want, not just her. there's hope, but as the other female anon told you-no one can promise you that it will work out in a situation like this.It might. It might not.The only decision you need to make is whether you can give "we" another chance or not.Once you make that decision you follow one of two paths: immediately embark on separation of assets, moving out etc. OR you make your ground rules and give yourself some time.Whether they are rules like those that female anon said or not, that will be for the two of you to sort out.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (12 March 2015): She is trying very hard to get you back. But she is still going after what SHE wants. It just happens to be you again. This feels good to you right now but it does not really show a willingness to put your respect & needs ahead of her own.
Guilt does not excuse the crime or the lying. Lots of criminals have guilt. They are still criminals.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (12 March 2015): Hi original poster. I first want to start this with saying I really do feel for you. I was you 8 months ago, posting on this site after I found out my partner of 6 years had been cheating on my for 2 months. I remember the confused, hurt daze that I sat in and wrote the post. It was the worst time of my life. Society dictates that if a person cheats on another person then they could not possibly love them and that the 'vicitim' of the cheating should always leave. People are quick to judge and say that the cheater doesn't want forgiveness that they only want to fool you. Of course sometimes this is true, but people often fail to look at the bigger picture. What led to this cheating? How did your relationship get to this? If you don't know the full picture then how can you judge. I want to maybe comfort you with my story. I know at this time all you want to hear is that everything's going to be ok. I can't promise you that it will. That depends on you and also heavily depends on her. I found out my partner had been cheating for 2 months. Repeatedly meeting the same women for sex whilst I thought he was out with friends/work. I was devastated. However if you look at my bigger picture I had neglected him and the relationship emotionally and physically for months prior to this. I'm not saying the cheating was my fault simply a factor in the bigger picture. He was desperate to be forgiven, he was utterly distraught and in pieces. I didn't know if I could do this, instead I made him come to me. He offered to make the effort to put things right and rebuild the trust. He promised to do that every single day until we could look back on what happened and say 'that was a really shit time but I'mGlad it happened as we are much stronger now' I told him that if one day passed where he didn't make the effort then that was it, I also said I would try to forgive him but could not promise anything. It's been the hardest 6/7 months of my life. I was constantly insecure and paranoid, doubting myself and upset. However he reassured me everyday, he gave me his passwords, his find his iphone so I could see exactly where he was at any time of the day, open access to his phone. Whilst I recognise this isn't healthy it was my safety blanket. When I felt anxious I would check where he was, check his phone and be reassured. I would say this last month is the first time since it's happened that I can can I'm truly happy. I no longer think about it every day, I do at least once a week but not every day. I can honestly say that the trust is slowly coming back, I no longer check his phone everyday or his where abouts.What's our relationship like now? It's happier than we have ever been. The communication is fantastic, we now have open communication and discuss our thoughts or feelings. Out arguments have vanished and if we do bicker it's always forgotten about within the hour. The effort is there fromBOTH of us as I realise I played a part in his betrayal. I simply did not comit myself enough to him. We are happy. Finally we are working towards the day where we can say I'm glad that it happened. It's still to raw right now but things are good. Only you and her truly know whether this is salvageable and some only know until you try. I would cancel the engagement and get back to basics. Communication is key and don't forget that. If you try and things don't work out then that's fine as well. You don't have to comit to anything right now, if it works then great, if you don't want to try that's also fine and if you try and it doesn't work they hey ho? Where's the harm in that if it let you come to terms with the relationship ending. All you need to comitt to right now is your happiness. Good luck.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (12 March 2015): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionto clarify as i feel it is rather important. she told the guy over a text that she loved him and always had (they had been best friends fo years) but that she truly loved me and wanted to be with me. It was him that originally declared his love for her, and it was then that he broke up with his girlfriend for her. and this was a time that we were arguing heavily. this is the point at which she withdrew from the situation with him and she told him not to break up with his girl for her it because she wanted to be with me and that she shouldn't be the reason they broke up. but he broke up with his ex anyway because he wasn't happy. she told me that she did this because she didn't want him to hate her and to let him down gently. She immediately reduced contact to pleasantries only and the only time she asked how he felt was when i said they could talk again, in which case she did it to find out how he felt and wouldnt have had him around if he felt the same (because she told me thats why she was donig it)he didnt go back to his girlfriend he has a new one and they fell out when she told him that she wanted to be with me. she apologised and said she hates herself for leading him on, and she wasnt herself (she doesnt know i saw these messages but she left her facebook account open one day when she was rushed away in an emergency and i read it)I know that the two of them have no future. I belive that and i dealt with that aroudn the time, as i knew she consdiered leaving me. she assured me that at the time it wasnt anything to do wiht him. it could have been anyone because she was so unhappy with me and looking back, i can see why. she had cried out to me and had tried to talk to me but i never responded. had i done so i am certain this wouldn't have happened. i strongly feel that this is why we have been so good since this happened (until i knew they had had a physical encounter). i think we were broken then. neither of us was happy and we should have either broken up then, or sorted it out. i completely understand why she did it. she needed to feel needed and i take my part of the blame for neglecting her. I agree that i did. its undeniable. i didn't deserve what happened tho as the neglect wasn't intentional.she committed to me when she got engaged to me and i think we did rebuild the relationship. after i knew i almost lost her (even though she is adamant that it wasn't anything to do with him specifically and could have been anyone)i hink what happened bought us closer. i am leaving in acouple of hours. i ave written her a lengthy letter in which i encourage her to truly think about how she feels and what she wants, issues with the relationship and why she was so cold to me. ill let u know the outcome of that.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (12 March 2015): I think people can offer you great testimonials and contrive very moving defenses, when they have betrayed your trust and they want to get past what they've done. All the excuses about not feeling loved and whatnot should have simply been resolved either through communication; or she should have just ended the relationship, and pursued the one she believed to truly love her. She doesn't hate him. She is angry, because he made an about-face. He went back to his girlfriend. He gave you the truth, while she hid it.
I think you should grapple with this, and sort it through your mind. It is a major decision; but from reading the lengthy posts you have written, I see a great deal of trepidation.
When someone cheats on their partner, that is one of the most difficult offenses one can do to someone who loves you. People who have a profound ability to forgive and move-on do not revisit old transgressions; because they know how to put it all behind them. They don't have to toil and squirm to reach that frame of mind where they can just move forward and start-over. They reach into themselves and find that gift within them; and they know when and how to use it. You can forgive without remaining in a relationship with the cheater. There are residual resentments that bury beneath the subconscious, and it manifests in distrust and suspicion. That is why I suggested that you consider ending this. It was a weak mess to begin with. I don't see where you are that forgiving, because your posts are too emotional and strained. The truth is, you wouldn't need advice; because you would count on your own intuition and use your own abilities to draw your own conclusions.
From what I know about people, they don't forsake you for other people if they have maintained their original feelings for you. They are usually no longer the same as they were before by the time this happens. You don't/can't shut your feelings off, and turn them back on like a faucet. The human mind is more complicated than that. A cheater exposed is like a criminal caught red-handed. They can offer a compelling argument in their own defenses, mainly because they don't want to face the consequences of what they've done. They can dig up reasons and move you with emotional dramatization that can bring you to tears. They can convince you it's your own fault. They flip the blame. It's not a question of forgiveness here anyway. She told another man she loved him over you. Consider what was in her heart at that time. Do you honestly think she has made a complete turnabout since she told him that?
Forgive her. That is the right thing to do. It is the moral thing to do. Just don't half-forgive her; then go back and forth with your emotions. Trust is hard to recover after betrayal. The offender will carry a stigma for the cheating, and every man she smiles at will be under suspicion. If her feelings go back and forth for you, why wouldn't they do the same about him? The operative word in all this is "love." She said she "loved" him. Now she doesn't?
Just remember full-forgiveness means this incident should never come-up again, and you must trust her and treat her as you did before. If you neglected her in the past, has she fully forgiven you for that? I think her argument is to save her own skin, and not be seen in a bad light. I think the regret comes more from being exposed for cheating, not for what she did; because she had a choice at the time not to do it. Drunkenness remains her defense; but she did say she loved him and thought he loved her. Her love for you should have proven strong enough to avoid making such a big mistake. Not once, but twice.
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A
female
reader, Honeypie  + ♥, writes (12 March 2015):
 EDIT:
I wrote:1. she knew an ACTUAL relationship with the other dude was realistic.
Should have been:
1. she knew an ACTUAL relationship with the other dude was unrealistic.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (12 March 2015): Yes,going away and letting it "breathe" for a while is a great idea!
Things might settle in your mind a bit during this time and once you read a bit about other people's experiences etc. then you can make your own choice.
There is no magic recipe and every case is highly individual. You might survive this (as a couple) or you might not. Depends. I mean some couples survive just not all.
Well, now you know what it is like on the other side of the coin. No matter how much remorse you felt when you did it, I bet you did not feel as much pain and confusion as you do now? You even called it a "sobering" event when you did it, something to make you "wake up".
Well,maybe this will have the same event-you'll wake up and realise what matters to you. Though, honestly I do NOT think that you find out what you want by cheating... Cheating is a symptom rather than a cause (in my opinion) and yes, it is a choice. And, no the other person does NOT cause it (this is a concept I think men find hard to grasp-no matter how unhappy/bored you were in the relationship in which you cheated that was NOT an excuse to cheat. If you are bored/unhappy/stressed-figure out whether you want to work on it or not, then if not-make a clean break and then go do whatever. Same applies to her. No matter how neglected she was (by you) in this relationship that was also NOT an excuse to cheat. It's no accident... I mean what "Honey,my dick accidentally felt straight in her vagina,I swear!...")
I personally wouldn't care how many times they did it... It's like adding fuel in the fire unnecessarily. I mean would it have mattered to you if it was 2 times but on the same night rather than in the morning? What about 3 times in one night? What if it was 2 guys and not one but on the same night? I mean, really no matter what the combination is the end result is the same: cheating is cheating.
If it occurred right after you told her you do not intend to marry her, I think this might have prompted it (though still doesn't excuse it).
You need a really frank talk and if you have to "squeeze" the truth out of her-that is no good. You need to talk about it and see if you can put it behind you or not.
And,yeah, karma...
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (12 March 2015): This is verified as being by the original poster of the question*** UPDATE ***
We have spoken. She told me that she was unhappy at the time and felt like i didn't care. when i said i didnt want to get married and stuff she took it to heart and said she hated me. She said she didn't go down to his with the intention of sleeping with him, and i believe this, she could have done it many times in the past if that was the case, and i am certain this didn't happen. She told me that she didnt think i cared and that he seemed crazy in love with her, he nevr took his eyes off her and made her feel wanted. She wanted to feel wanted. She loved to feel wanted... she said. She confessed that she didn enjoy it and she went back for seconds because she genuinly felt like he loved her and i didnt seem to care. She said that hit hit her on the way home the next day (she was down there for several days) and that she knew at this point that she didn't love him . It was when they came back that he declaired his love for her and we had been arguing lots because i knew something was up. she said that she never actually loved him, she just wanted to break up with me out of guilt because she didnt want to have to tell me because she knew it would ruin me. She said that she kept it from me bacause she knew that she wanted to be with me and loved me. the days she came back ironically enough i had announced before i knew that i was sorry for not spending much time with her and that now she had graduated we could be closer... ha!
regardless, she is adamant that she does love and want to be with me and that she tried to break up with me many times so that she didnt have to break my heart by telling me, but also wouldnt have to live a lie. Thinking back on it, i can recall at least 3 occasions when she was going to tell me and choked and made out she was on about something else. the first time was actually a day or so after she returned.
I do think she wants to be with me because there is absolutely no reason she would need to be. Financially and stuff she is sound now.
I do think she regrets it. and ive seen her tear herself to pieces for several months over this (granted i didn't know what i was over).
She said that the main reason she never could tell me was that she knew that she wanted to be with me and that that was never a doubt after it happened. She said she never could have left me ad that the messages to him were basically telling him what he wanted to hear. She said she didnt think i cared, and he seemed to want to love her, so she liked having the attention. She also didnt want her best friend to hate her.
She had cried and broken her heart to me. she said she hates herself and that she wasnt happy at the time and I agree with what other people say. I think she had left the relationship when it happened 8/9 months ago. Since then we did get stronger and the best we've been for as long as i can remember and she knew that she wanted to be with me, which is why she accepted my proposal, but that she knew if she told me, id never look at her the same way and id leave her/
I do understand why she did it but I really don't think it justifies it. it would be so easy for either of us to leave right now, but she doesn't want that i have no idea what i want. sometimes being in the same room with her makes my skin crawl and im furious, but i can see shes trying and that she's sorry and that helps.
I understand why she did it now, but i can't understand how she could do it.
The question is can i get over it. i know if i can it will make us stronger, but i think this is something only time will tell. I haven't told her yet, but im going to go away at least for a week and remove myself from the situation. I want to know why i want to be in the relationship and make sure its not out of familiarity. a week ago i was walking on air, the question is, can i get back to that knowing what i know. will this be a quesion of what doesnt kill you makes you stronger, or more a case of what doesnt kill you leaves you dying slowly?
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A
female
reader, Honeypie + ♥, writes (12 March 2015):
If you can't work towards forgiveness? then yes, I think you should end it.
You seem to have a LOT of questions about her actions, but have you actually SAT her down and talked? For her to say to someone else that she LOVES him and unsure about her feelings for you, to me at least means she was detaching herself FROM you and the relationship. She STAYED with you for two reasons (I think) 1. she knew an ACTUAL relationship with the other dude was realistic. 2. you two have invested 7 years together, there is a familiarity that is HARD to let go off. I'm sure you two live together and share ALL kind of financial and personal obligations that isn't EASY to walk away from.
There is no magical fix to this. And only YOU can decide If you believe it's possible to move forward knowing what you know, or not.
Personally, cheating is a deal-breaker for me. Cheating IS a choice.
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reader, anonymous, writes (12 March 2015): I tell my readers on on DC all the time. If you cheat or steal someone's mate, there is karma. Just when you're nice and comfy with yourself, someone comes along and does the same-thing to you. You've learned a major lesson here. My main concern is that you come to grips with the facts. That you don't try to keep the relationship going; if you don't have it in you to offer forgiveness without torturing her, and yourself
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reader, anonymous, writes (11 March 2015): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionIts crazy some of you have got parts spot on. I tried to leave originally, but she begged me not to and said she was sorry and that she just felt so low and like I didn't care about her. I openly admit that id been neglecting her at that tome for a while. I was addicted to my work and she was ignored. I genuinely feel that when she went there she was blown away by this guy shoeing her the levels of atte ripm I hadn't for provably years. I think she wanted to be with him at that point. I agree she had broken up with me then. I read the messages she sent to the guy that said she loved him, but it wasn't how she felt about me and that she really wanted things to work with me so she cut contact (though she lied about the odd message). I believe that she regrets imwhat she did and hates herself for it because I saw an overnight change in her personality. She clearly hates herself right now. I don't think her decision is between me and him. He is firmlynouy of the picture. They now hate each other as it got volotile when she chose me and they don't speak. He also lives 200miles away. At the moment I am going from. Being confused to angry, but as aprofessilnal poker player I am used to detaching myself from certain factors. I have chated on my partner on the last (a different one) whole I was at university. I regretted it immediately and know it came from sexual frustration. I was happy in my relationship at the tome, I was very drunk and it was reall sobering. I will never cheat again. I know how it feels to be ob both sides of the coin and I know that anyone who does it more than once has to be evil. You only put your hand in the fire once. I asked her what she wants and gave her an east get out and she assured me she wants to he with me and hopes incan forgive her. I don't agree that she lied to protect herself. If she wanted out shed have surely told me earlier. Its actually 9 months ago now it happened and up until a few days ago we were ik agreat place. Um confused I really am. I'm going to go away for a few days and let me initial feelings steady out. This could fp either way, right now I think it will be a break up because of my attitude towards her physically now. She's changed in my estimations, though I never thought id cheat so I guess that would make me a hypocrite. I have a good break up avenue of it comes to it. Been offered an opportunity abroad so could take it. But I feel I have to at least try to make this work. Any ideas on a time frame that I should set? Like of its not fine in a month leave etc. Or does everyone think I should leave now?
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reader, anonymous, writes (11 March 2015): Regrettably your relationship is over. She maybe debating whom to choose but that implies she does not want you. She is a lier and a cheat so just end this, take the pain which will be erased over time.
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reader, anonymous, writes (11 March 2015): I don't think it is reconcilable or that you will ever get over it. I know because I was cheated on last summer by my boyfriend. But I didn't find out till after we had moved in together. I felt all the things you felt. What made me feel worse is that it wasn't random. It was planned. I wish it had been some drunken stupid random thing. But it was all premeditated and planned. He made plans behind my back to hook up with an old flame and cheat. And then of course lied about it and made me think for the longest time that he had been out doing something else during that time. Something harmless. Though at the end of the day cheating is cheating. But I can sympathize with you finding all these levels to it.It sucks cause he and I were so passionate and couldn't keep our hands off each other. But after I found out, the passion died instantly. We still live together oddly enough. But our relationship is not the same quality that it used to be. We're just roommates really. We've gone through these periods where we try to reconcile but it always ends up fizzing out or blowing up. Our relationship feels cheap, to me. It lost all its resiliency. Credibility.And I no longer trust him. And that's the problem with cheating. You can't trust that person anymore. And without trust, your relationship is a shit show.
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reader, anonymous, writes (11 March 2015): My instinct is to say : "let go" and I do think that's the right decision (and better you KNOW now BEFORE marriage of what she did 6 months ago,but NEVER told you. I'd send roses, chocolate and expensive gifts to whoever called you and told you about it-now they have your best interest at heart... Or,if a woman, may even have their eye on you and might not be doing it so selflessly after all)Anyways, that's my instinct BUT on the other hand-after cheating -she didn't tell you. yes, terrible and she should have told you BUT you told her did NOT want to marry her during your trip. She is not a mind reader! You say the cheating happened right after this, the other dude did not have a gf and he told her he loved her! You just told her you didn't/your intentions were not serious! yes, I get that you were trying to not spoil the surprise, but you say this happened immediately AFTER that remark?No surprise there... Also, she could have left for other dude who said loved her and did not have a gf,but didn't. Maybe she did not wanna hurt you and see what will happen with the relationship (I'm being charitable).- Why are so many people in this? What is HIS INTEREST in telling you what happened? why does HE want YOU to know?Ok,anyway, do whatever you feel is best if you think you can TRULY leave this behind after therapy etc. If not-there is no saving it, it's already dead in the water.The only thing that will disturb me is WHY is it so HARD to get the truth out of her? Why do you have to PRESS so hard to get it? Why lie in your face when you have EVIDENCE? ps: cheaters don't show remorse as such...It's psychological-I read a bit around it, it's the same symptom like murderers- IF they do show/let emotions get to them they won't be able to live with themselves(i.e nobody wants to wake up in the morning and think of themselves as a monster. Somebody else is always the monster. Not them...). So no emotions are ever let in. Compartmentalising emotions very successfully. Those with slightly narcissistic/ selfish traits do it much better than the rest of us...That explains your question on "so cold/ did not see remorseful when telling me".I wouldn't put my heart in it if I were you, but I'm not you. Think if you can forgive and make your choices.
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reader, anonymous, writes (11 March 2015): The length of your post is a testament to your shattered feelings and broken-heart. I feel you, brother!
I think the best thing you can do for yourself; is to just let this relationship end, once and for all. You'll keep saying how much you love her; but you'll keep punishing her for what she did. Love can't flourish when tainted with resentment and half-baked forgiveness. Keeping things in suspense; because you can't deal with the pain of a breakup.
It was not just a drunken-mistake. It was a deliberate act of cheating; allowing alcohol to be the excuse for the lack of restraint. If you purposely place yourself with someone you have the hots for; while you're away from the one you're committed to, the "feelings" were there in the first place. Alcohol was just an ingredient added to impair the conscience long enough to enjoy the act. If they were too drunk, they both would have passed-out; and nothing would have happened at all. They were conscious enough to have sex. All along; they were plotting in secret behind everyone's back. They are adults. Accountable and responsible for their actions.
Now back to you.
You forgive only in theory; but not psychologically, nor in the moral-sense. You don't want to feel the grief of loss. You're lying to both her and yourself; claiming that you can get over it. You just want to hold her in suspended animation while you sort it out.
You can't do that!!! She'll up and leave you first!
Maybe forgiveness will come somewhere in the far-off future; but she can't sit around waiting while you toil over it. One minute you're furious, then totally confused the next. No one can live under a cloud like that, my friend. Neither of you.
You're going to have to deal with the withdrawal-effect from your detachment from her. The co-dependency has to be broken; so you'll stop playing the emotional-game of going back and forth. Having dramatic-tantrums about what she did one minute, and reminiscing on how sweet it used to be the next.
I know the mess that you are right now, my friend. Been there and done that! Can't put an arm around your shoulder and share a beet. So, I'll give you some good advice.
All she really wants from you is for you to just forget about it. She has/had feelings for the other guy. You had a hard-time getting the truth out of her. If you don't trust her; please tell me how you'll have it in you to forgive her? Can you just move-on like it never happened? Really?!!
If it wasn't for the lying, this might be salvageable. The problem is, you pressed and pressed for the truth. So that exercise in itself has irreparably damaged your ability to trust and to forgive. Your patience has been stressed and strained to the breaking-point. You're not a married-couple saving a marriage.
You'll just have to gain the courage to deal with the misery of the breakup. Then undergoing the emotional process that follows. Doing so will allow you to reset your feelings. You're wasting energy fighting with yourself.
It takes time. There is no shortcut. You go through emotional-phases; until your subconscious reaches acceptance that it is over. Your emotional wounds are like physical wounds; they heal over time. Healing-time varies according to your personality and other factors; but from the length of your post, it will be hard. You're an emotional-guy.
Recovery is a long and painful process; and you're avoiding that process with all your might. It is inevitable. You cannot turn-back time,and she cannot undo what she did.
She cheated, and you had to pry the truth out of her with a crowbar. She lied because she wanted to getaway with it. She doesn't want to deal with the consequences of her lying and cheating. Nobody does! So of course she's going to claim she loves you to death, so-on and so-forth. You were the last thing on her mind when they were having sex.
It is all forgivable as time passes. It is not forgettable.
Therefore, your efforts to get past this will be delayed.
She should not have to endure the time it takes for you to reach that stage. I don't know about anyone else; but man, your post says it all to me.
The truth is, she confessed and wants you to just get over it. You know you're not going to get over this over-night.
This could stretch-out for years!
At this point in time, you probably can't/won't/don't trust her. So the raggedy-relationship you're clinging to; is going to be fight, after fight, after fight! With moments of calm; while you mull over your wounded-feelings. No one deserves to live with one foot in hell, and the other in purgatory.
Man-up, breakup, and deal with the detachment process and its symptoms of withdrawal. It's like the agony of going cold-turkey from an addictive-narcotic; but necessary to initiate your healing process. You're feeling like hell right now, but it does get better. I'm living proof.
The prognosis it good. You will recover, get-over her, and move on with your life. Your love and your feelings are in a bad place right now; and this is evidenced by the emotionally-charged and lengthy post you have written. People cannot hold-out indefinitely waiting for your forgiveness; and they can't endure the stress and quilt you place upon them while you try. Letting her go, will be having mercy on the both of you.
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reader, chigirl  +, writes (11 March 2015):
 She threw away your relationship. She did it. There's nothing you can do about that, you can't keep her locked up.
You know the saying, if you love someone you set them free? If they come back they are yours, if they don't they were never yours.
You gave her freedom: you gave her your trust. Now what did she do with it? She took it and went away and cheated, which is a cowards way of ending things. She was planning to leave you, as you saw through messages, and the moment she cheated she LEFT you. Just didn't tell you, that's the problem. But she had already left. Everything that happened since then was a lie and a fraud. You were in a one sided relationship, because she had already left.
There's nothing to be saved, and nothing you can do, because this isn't a problem caused by outside factors. This is a situation caused by one person NOT wanting to be in the relationship, and then other wanting a relationship. She pulled out and away. You need to accept that and come to terms with it. She left you 6 months ago when she cheated. The relationship has been over ever since, you just weren't told.
You are young. There are other women in the world for you to love, who will love you in return, and who always come back to you when you set them free. This one left, so come to terms with that, and don't hold on to her for any longer. She made her decision 6 months ago, and there's no going back to change the past. She made a conscious decision. Blaming booze is just crap lies. She wasn't forced, and no one made her do what she did against her will. She did it willingly, consciously, and happily. You saw the text messages, written when sober, to confirm it all.
Let go of her.
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reader, anonymous, writes (11 March 2015): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionThanks so much. just to confirm. i asked her to marry me. I only found out a few days ago. i can see why she felt like she did, but i still don't take the blame. She's apologised profusely and said that she wants to stay with me. ~I decided i will forgive her and have told her that she needs to give me 100% effort to make it as easy as possible. its going to be tough for both of us, but i think its better to try and it not work out than regret not trying. her personality changed after tis. she hasnt been herself. hopefully she will return now and learn from her mistake.
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reader, Honeypie + ♥, writes (11 March 2015):
YOU made a HUGE mistake in proposing to someone who had JUST cheated on you with her "best friend".
I get that people don't want to feel like they wasted x amount of years with nothing to show, but I think YOUR mistake was to think that a proposal or a wedding ring on her finger will make everything OK again.
I doubt it was JUST one drunken mistake. And I also doubt it was all your fault (as she claims)- but here is the thing, SHE went to visit him. I doubt she was clueless to his feelings for her.
IT DOES happen that relationships gets stale, boring and someone feels neglected or overworked. It's life. The longer you are WITH someone the more everything becomes routine. However, routine isn't ALWAYS a bad thing.
I've been married for 17 years. It's not all roses and unicorn farts. There are times where I have focused WAY more on the kinds than my husband (and thus neglecting him a tad) and there have been times where HE has focused more on work and co-workers than the kids and I (and thus neglecting me). But here is the thing, I didn't go seek attention from other men, or cheat. Neither did he. WE SAT down and talked and worked it out. And THIS is why we are still together after 19 years.
I would suggest you either do some PRE-MARITAL counseling or couples counseling IF you WANT to stay with her. YOU should NOT under ANY circumstances MARRY her until this issue is resolved.
You shouldn't "try" to forgive her. You NEED to either FORGIVE or dump her. TRYING to forgive will get you nowhere. And honestly, isn't fair on her either. This should not be something you can HOLD over her head whenever YOU are not happy. And vice versa. Forgiving someone means you "ERASE" the sin/deed, it's PUT in the past and NOT discussed further. It's no ammo for a later fight. Or justification for other behavior.
Forgiving takes time and effort. And while the "deed" is erased, you will never be able to forget it, NEITHER will she.
You have to decide if you can do it or not. But don't go "try" halfasses. To quote a SMART little green fella (Yoda)
"Try not. Do, or do not. There is no try."
Many relationships have survived infidelity, some becomes stronger others more fragile. And the many MORE have ended because of it. It's up to you (and your GF/fiance) to figure which path you can handle.
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reader, anonymous, writes (11 March 2015): I think you need to cancel the engagement and move out.If it had been a drunken one night stand and she'd confessed afterwards or with some prompting. you may be able to move past it. The fact is that she's lied throughout and may still be lying.You noticed a change in her when she came back and she denied anything. Then she says that he confessed his love to her but that nothing happened. She moves in with you agrees to marry you, all the time keeping her secret. You then confront her with what you've heard and give her a chance to come clean. Again she lies about it. When she finally admits to it, she still isn't telling you the whole truth. When you confront her about doing it twice, she lies again! If it was me, I couldn't trust anything that this woman says to me. Without trust you don't have a relationship. If you're checking her phone, you don't trust her. If she lies to your face even when it's making you ill, you can't trust her.It actually sounds like a toxic relationship. If you feel the need to interrogate her and go through her phone whilst telling her who she's allowed to talk to, that's a very bad sign. If she can lie to you for months and even now probably hasn't told you the whole truth (if you're so drunk the following morning that you don't know what you're doing, you must have been unconscious the night before!), then to me it's over.Get some space, heal yourself and move on. Ideally go no contact and just have nothing else to do with her.
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reader, anonymous, writes (11 March 2015): "She thinks we should break up as shes ruined it."She's right. Not only for screwing up but for how she has acted afterwards. Something stuck with me about your story. She said she did it again the next morning because she had already screwed up. IMO this is a big red flag. If she was guilty about cheating then she should not have been able to just do it again like that. She was thinking pragmatically (selfishly) and she didn't seem too bothered about doing it. She knew she wasn't supposed to do it on principle but she didn't mind doing it again once that line was crossed. She does not exactly seem overcome with guilt about what she did or how she let you tie yourself in knots over it later. She seems more bothered about the practical problems it has caused. That sounds pretty selfish.
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reader, SensitiveBloke +, writes (11 March 2015):
 You are engaged to a cheat and a liar. You can't build any proper relationship with a person like this. You deserve so much better. End this now.
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