A
female
age
41-50,
*ryingToBeFree2023
writes:Back when I was in HS, somewhere in there, I began to suspect I was a lesbian. I *think* the seed was planted in 6th grade when Look Who’s Talking came out (1991 or so?) and the main character, not wanting her Jewish parents to know she was pregnant out of wedlock (I think it was an affair with her boss) so she said she was artificially inseminated. That was the first time I’d ever learned that a person could make a baby without a boy being involved. I thought that sounded great! At that time, I had a vague idea about sex. I’d had one year of sex ed at that point, in Catholic school. The girls were separated from the boys and we were given drawings of BOTH reproductive systems and we memorized the names and locations and had a general idea of what those things did. As for “what happens to your body”, we only learned about our own gender. We were admonished not to talk about it outside of class or to take a peek at the boys’ blue booklet. Someone got ahold of it and read it in the locker rooms. I thought the idea of erections was TERRIFYING. I couldn’t imagine my lunch-friend Brandon getting “an erection” out of nowhere or just because you could see my training bra through my uniform shirt. Some boys brought up the see-through shirt things and made a mention of some tall girl’s long legs. Later that year, ALL girls were expected to wear undershirts and opaque tights from then on. We were also separated in gym class and told that girls were no longer allowed on the swings or playground equipment. Before we were no longer allowed to share lunch tables, Brandon revealed to our mutual friend Lupe that someone had asked “a really bad question” in the boy’s class. He couldn’t say it aloud, but one of the boys asked what happened if you couldn’t stop playing with yourself. Years later, we learned that the gym coach (who did boy’s sex ed with the priest/principal) told them that “nocturnal emissions” were a way to relieve tension naturally without doing anything bad. The priest then spoke up and told them that those dreams were a result of visiting sex demons who arrived as a result of impure thoughts and images throughout the day. Brandon didn’t mention this until years later because he was terrified and embarrassed. I’d had some sexual experience between the ages of 5-8, although I didn’t know it. It’s all mixed up for me, but I remember Vacation Bible School being held mostly in the church basement. The girl’s bathroom was to the left of the kitchen and just off to the side was a concrete walled area where all kinds of randomness was stored. Like the Nativity scene and the old crucifix, which looked like a very skeletal version of Jesus. It was huge (truly) and genuinely scary and us kids would sneak back and uncover it to touch it on a dare. I don’t know how many times it happened, but an older kid got me back there and basically touched me with skeleton Jesus watching. I don’t know if he was even in High School or middle school. I know it happened more than once. I know I sort of performed oral on him. I remember the smell and thinking it was like an uncooked hotdog that had been left on the kitchen table too long. Probably just kids messing around, but it was traumatic for me because I had been told that my body was a vehicle for the Holy Spirit and that only Mommy or a nurse should ever see my privates until I was married.I’d been so sheltered and not allowed to even watch Roseanne or The Simpsons and only allowed to listen to classical music or church music, so I truly thought “dates” were when a guy took you out to dinner or a movie or a walk or something nice. I thought that meant you’d go on dates, decide to be his girlfriend, and then… I never really thought past that. My friends had boyfriends but I only had three friends throughout my school year and they were the same ones throughout. Lupe and a girl named Heather were the girls, Brandon was the boy. One time or another, he had a crush on one or the other of them and he was very mean to me. I only hung around because they were the only friends I had and there he was all the time. Turned out he thought I liked him and he wanted to be mean to get me to stop. It was causing him to get bullied. It was bad: most people thought he was gay because he was a concert pianist from a very young age (literally flew through Chopin at 11 and out-played High School kids in Honor’s Bands) and was into theater because he could imitate anyone’s walk or voice without meaning to. He was raised by a stereotypical hillbilly mamaw who didn’t know what to do with him. She worked nights and he sat up watching pianists and musicians on TV and one day started messing around on a keyboard in a music store in the mall. He was truly an out of nowhere prodigy and still is. He’s composed many pieces and is well-known in classical circles. We thought he was fascinating. I never had feelings for him, I just wanted to be his friend. The girls started shunning me because every time I was around they got caught doing whatever they were doing that was wrong. Mostly I was their lookout when they made out with boys or smoked cigarettes or stole something and I was bad at it. The Youth Group kids were mean to me because I was “too weird”. I didn’t know what even they were talking about because I’d been too sheltered and quite often they’d purposely put me in positions where I got in trouble or tell on me for things I didn’t do or say and because they were the majority, I wasn’t believed. I was told, “They don’t want you there then, maybe you’re bothering them” by teachers.In HS, turned out that boys just wanted to get alone and make out. I thought it was gross. Truly cringey gross and my first reflex was to push a guy away (thumbs in the trachea) and jump out of his car. He’d promised to take me to a movie but parked behind the theater in an alley. I called my parents and *I* was grounded. From going anywhere with anyone unless one of my parents were right there. No one wanted to hang out with me. At school events I was allowed to go, but guys just wanted to pull me aside “to talk” and then they groped me all over the place. Not wanting to get in trouble, I let them. I lost friendship with Lupe and Heather because they told me I was “social poison” and bragged about how popular they were once they got rid of me. They DID both get popular once they started being mean to me. I did have one Youth Group girl who was nice to me named Faith and she invited me on an overnight. We slept in her bed and I was up all night wondering what was wrong with me because I could sense the heat coming off of her and it was like holding two magnets together and not letting them touch. She never mentioned anything about it, but I was terrified “she knew” and I attempted suicide by swallowing a bottle of sleeping pills with half a bottle of gin a few nights later. My parents took me to get my stomach pumped and somehow got me OUT of juvenile psych unit and had me talk to a priest once a week. I learned that suicide is a sin that sends you to Hell. I was told to immerse myself in the church and learn to be more grateful.In college, I looked forward to the freedom to really be myself and not to have to go to church. I wanted to catch up with my peers when it came to movies, books, music and so on. I wanted to experience with partying (just alcohol and weed) and try sex with guys to see what was wrong with me for not wanting to make out. (Seriously, I was told that I didn’t enjoy it because I felt guilty for doing it). I also thought I was a lesbian and I thought that if I came out as bi, the Queer Union for _______ Students would welcome and help me. That was a horrible mistake I’ve paid for for decades. Turns out the LGBT+ community hates me because bisexuals with no experience are just “curious” and want to use lesbians as lab rats for sexual experience. Or, we’re greedy sex fiends who want the best of both worlds and are constantly horny and never faithful. Oh. And I just wanted attention from guys. (All of that could not be further from the truth). The non-religious “straight” society meant boyfriends thought we were in an open relationship or that I was totally OK with looking at women/porn/whatever or always open to a three way and so on. They’d get mad when I said I had no bi friends (nor knew anyone bi) who were willing to have a three way. Well… I think it’s disrespectful to even think to ask someone to do that and I’ve always personally been monogamous. This is not to say polyamorous people are wrong (they’re not), but I personally do not want to even … no. I’ve literally been asked by both LGBT+ people and non-religious straight people, “Why bother saying you’re bi then?” Well… because I hoped someday to get an opportunity to date woman, get to know her, get in a relationship and end up getting to experience sex to see if I like it. I’ve realized way too late that if I haven’t had sex experience with a woman now, I’m never going to.It is literally against my own morals/ethics (nothing to do with religion) to use a person for sex to see if I like it. It’s not fair. It’s disrespectful. It always has been. I’ve also never had any idea if a woman is gay or bi or what have you unless she’s “obvious” which means she tells people or acts a stereotype. The only women to express interest in me, I ended up rejecting and hurting because their (no fault of their own) attraction to me made me very uncomfortable and scared. While I never said it aloud, if a woman is “too” butch (in appearance or personality or something I can’t explain) then to me, that defeated the point of dating a woman in the first place. Flirting with a woman never came naturally to me - I don’t think I’ve done it and when I felt a woman was flirting with me, I felt EQUALLY as uncomfortable as I did when a male was flirting with me. Mostly because if she was nice, I didn’t want to hurt her or accidentally lead her on. The fact that most Lesbian woman won’t date bi/bi curious women also kept me from experimenting. I was so determined to leave the Faith I was raised in (so I could come out and live honestly and be myself without guilt or shaming or being told I was wrong) that I didn’t stop to think that the problem wasn’t the theology, the problem was that staying involved in Church meant there was no room to come out of the closet. There was no room to experiment with weed or alcohol. There was no room to experiment with Wicca. There was no room to be pro-choice. and so on and so on… yeah. Basically, I wanted to find a faith that matched what I thought my values were rather than changing my (wrong) opinions to match the church.I’ve realized now that while I truly don’t think it’s wrong to be LGBT+ (because it’s not a choice and therefore not a sin), I simply don’t fit in there. And I never will. They never supported me when I needed it so I really don’t see the need to support them. Their double standards are just as cruel as those of non-religious straight society and even more cruel than the religious people who shame me and tell me I’m wrong. Truly, that has been my experience. The truth is, I’m not (and never have been) attracted to women like I thought I was. I’m simply not attracted (and never have been) to men. I’m ASEXUAL. Apparently, I’m a natural at flirting with men even though I have always approached every relationship with a man with FRIENDSHIP ONLY as my true motive. It’s never ended well or been well. Women think I’m after their man. Or, I reject a (genuinely nice) guy and the guy and people who wanted to see us together delight in the “karma” I receive when a not-so-nice guy takes me into a hostageship that is drawn out and abusive. Even my own parents said I should “consider it penance” for all the nice guys I turned down. No one has taken me seriously when I say I don’t want sex because due to addiction (another drawn out but unfortunately true story) I ended up prostituting. Even when I tried to hang around church people (of supposedly progressive churches) NO ONE took me seriously when I said I didn’t want to date or have a relationship. People, religious or non religious heard, “I’m easy and willing to give away free sex to anyone”. Couldn’t be further than the truth. Every guy I tried to dump who was bad made my life miserable when I tried to dump them and I’ve turned good guys bad and lost full friendship groups many times over because of “what I did to him” when I tried to end things because I only wanted to be friends. Somehow, I’m ALWAYS in the wrong. Even when I complained about being sexualized I’m told “you must think you’re something special, you need your ego knocked down a few notches”. No… I actually DO get sexualized. Even the religious people can’t stand to see a woman perpetually single because they think she’s basically a slut or a secret lesbian - either way no female wants to be friends with her. Even in my upbringing, it was basically assumed that if a woman (or man) never married, they were too picky or basically should throw themselves into if not the priesthood or the convent, at least some sort of lay ministry. When I rant (like I’m doing) about how oversexed the world/society is, I’m shut down for spouting “puritanical bullshit we should be past by now”. But… I don’t CARE if other people want to have free sex, doesn’t mean I can’t live a sex-free life. Doesn’t mean I should be lonely and friendless (like I always have been). I’ve tried progressive churches and I’m not progressive enough. I’ve tried the one I came from and I’m too world-worn to get any respect at all. The non-religious world has eaten me alive and I’m still too clueless to be anything but fodder. I try to make friends with a guy (saying up front that I just want to be friends) and as soon as we exchange contact information (messenger for example), we end up doing what he thinks is flirting. He at some point sexualizes me or expresses a desire to date me. Or, tells me that he heard me say I just wanted to be friends but since I kept talking to him it was all mixed messages. Huh? Honest question: I don’t talk about sex, I in fact shut down any sexual conversation, I dress very conservatively and I’m very much not a toucher. To the point where I stopped going to Narcotics Anonymous meetings because in Narcotics Anonymous culture they greet each other with hugs and I’m not comfortable with that. So I truly don’t understand how I sent mixed messages at all. I’ve tried making friends with women but they all steer clear of me like there’s something wrong with me. I tried meeting women in AA but they’re mentor’s, not friends. Same with co workers and classmates. They hate AA because “it pushes religion”. No… you find a god of your UNDERSTANDING. It can be a freaking light bulb if you wish. Spirituality is NOT religion. Oh, but religious people hate AA because “the spiritual aspect is lost, you could choose a light bulb as your higher power!” once again, I’m wrong all the way around. I’ve tried Buddhist, Atheist, Pagan (of several types) sponsors and I’m told I’m “too conservative and closed minded” for them to sponsor me. I’ve tried religious ones and I’m told, “I’m too sexual and need Jesus”. There seems to be no place for me at all. I came out in an LGBT+ meeting and have received the cold shoulder since I said I was asexual. I was approached and told that I was appropriating their culture and really didn’t belong and maybe I should join a church. Um… since when does sexual orientation have anything to do with getting sober? Oh, I tried a transwoman as a sponsor thinking it didn’t matter and she hit on me. As in physically tried to come onto me after having been alone with her multiple times, sharing traumas with her and… yeah, I had every reason to trust her and she betrayed me. She told me I wasn’t as open minded as I pretended to be.I’m writing all this because it’s the best I can do at telling the truth. I feel I have no one to listen because I’ve tried therapists and they focus only on addiction or sex abuse (I’ve had more since that childhood experience) and it isn’t helping. I guess I want validation that I’m not crazy. That there’s some way or place for me to fit into. Some place to belong. Some way of making friends without pissing people off. Somewhere where I’m not too liberal (because I don’t care what gender a person id’s with nor do I care who wants to sleep with who. Also, there are some (very few) situations where I can see why a woman would see the need to terminate a pregnancy. Generally though? If she CHOSE to have sex and there’s nothing physically dangerous about carrying the pregnancy to term, she’s not being forced to give birth because she CHOSE that option when she chose to have sex. She could have used birth control. She could have abstained. It’s called ADOPTION. It’s called CONSEQUENCES. It’s called, sex should never be consequence free. Today’s society lets people (literally) get away with murder. But from a church person’s perspective, I’m too liberal. I’m perpetuating “perversion” by standing up for LGBT+ people who have generally been very ungrateful for any support I offered. Couple that with the fact that they essentially want me back in the closet (or tell me The A in LGBTQIA+ doesn’t belong). Why should I support them? They sure don’t support me! Yes, I’m angry. Very angry. I always have been but I’ve always been silenced. If someone is able to read though the anger and the frustration and the desperation to find something for me, please - - - - help. I’m serious. This is the best I can do to be fully open and honest and I’m sorry it’s so long. I’ve been trying to ask for help from strangers (who can’t hurt me as much as people in my life) but I don’t know how. Iv’e tried one issue at a time trying to talk from the perspective of the age I was when certain things happened… because I wanted to see precisely what I should have done so I can end the many cycles/spirals that have always been part of my life. I couldn’t be more serious. I’ll even post my initialsV.N.T.
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Fancy yourself as an agony aunt? Add your answer to this question! A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (12 June 2023): Wow I am a few years younger than you but can somewhat relate. I am very girly, and no one would ever suspect but I was also raised in a religious home (Christian) and I am almost certain I am a lesbian. Thanks for sharing your story. I just want to say please don't give up on reaching out and trying to find your place. I wish the best of luck to you, and remember you're not alone!
A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (11 June 2023): In college, I looked forward to the freedom to really be myself and not to have to go to church. I wanted to catch up with my peers when it came to movies, books, music and so on. I wanted to experience with partying (just alcohol and weed) and try sex with guys to see what was wrong with me for not wanting to make out. (Seriously, I was told that I didn’t enjoy it because I felt guilty for doing it). I also thought I was a lesbian and I thought that if I came out as bi, the Queer Union for _______ Students would welcome and help me. That was a horrible mistake I’ve paid for for decades. Turns out the LGBT+ community hates me because bisexuals with no experience are just “curious” and want to use lesbians as lab rats for sexual experience. Or, we’re greedy sex fiends who want the best of both worlds and are constantly horny and never faithful. Oh. And I just wanted attention from guys. (All of that could not be further from the truth). The non-religious “straight” society meant boyfriends thought we were in an open relationship or that I was totally OK with looking at women/porn/whatever or always open to a three way and so on. They’d get mad when I said I had no bi friends (nor knew anyone bi) who were willing to have a three way. Well… I think it’s disrespectful to even think to ask someone to do that and I’ve always personally been monogamous. This is not to say polyamorous people are wrong (they’re not), but I personally do not want to even … no. I’ve literally been asked by both LGBT+ people and non-religious straight people, “Why bother saying you’re bi then?” Well… because I hoped someday to get an opportunity to date woman, get to know her, get in a relationship and end up getting to experience sex to see if I like it. I’ve realized way too late that if I haven’t had sex experience with a woman now, I’m never going to.There is just way too much to unpack in your post. I'll just use this paragraph. Clearly, you were very sheltered and unfortunately, MOST of the world sees a person in your shoes as easy to take advantage of. With your upbringing, most people were probably honest and did what they said they would do. Most things were simple black-and-white for you. Instead of helping point you in the right direction or educating you, your "friends" took advantage of you and threw you under the bus multiple times. TBH, people with your upbringing who try to make it "in the real world" quite often fail miserably. Unfortunately, that's by design. You would have been better off sticking to the church and talking to people there about your issues. The problem is, they would have judged the Hell out of you and told you you were wrong and you wanted to escape that. The truth is, you WERE wrong. You were wrong to think you were a lesbian just because you had a one-time fleeting "attraction" to a friend and no desire to mess around with boys. Maybe you ARE asexual after all, but you shouldn't have had sexual experience to tell you that. The solution, of course, is NOT TO DATE IN THE FIRST PLACE. If you'd talked to someone from Church about your problems, you could have explained that there was no actual "lust" towards women, just a lack of attraction towards guys. They would have THEN steered you in the direction of lay ministry or something like that. You would have been (mostly) surrounded by people who ENCOURAGED celibacy. You are making this harder than it is. the problem wasn’t the theology, the problem was that staying involved in Church meant there was no room to come out of the closet. There was no room to experiment with weed or alcohol. There was no room to experiment with Wicca. There was no room to be pro-choice. and so on and so on… yeah. Basically, I wanted to find a faith that matched what I thought my values were rather than changing my (wrong) opinions to match the church.(1) You're not gay anyway so you don't NEED to come out of the closet(2) Weed/alcohol are things a recovering addict shouldn't touch anyway so that's no longer a factor(3) Wicca was attractive to you (probably) because it seemed to offer power where you felt powerless, it was women-centered rather than patriarchal and it essentially lacks a list of "thou shalt not..." so those who practice can basically do what they want. Think about where THAT thinking landed you. You don't have to think hard.(4) You're hardly pro-choice at all! You did cite medical necessity and rape as "possible" reasons for abortion, but you also called it murder. Honey, that's super-judgmental! You don't know anyone's circumstances.You are ALWAYS going to be wrong because you are trying to serve two masters. Even the Goddess doesn't like that. ;-) You have always wanted the best of both worlds, to have it both ways, to have your cake and eat it too! No, there's nothing wrong with not wanting sex and you should have to explain that to anyone or defend that. The solution? Don't date. Seriously. It's that simple. Don't flirt. If "just talking" has always gotten understood to be flirting DON'T TALK SO MUCH. You ARE sending mixed messages when you keep talking to guys who are interested when you're not. You're giving false hope! Read the advice you gave another poster a few questions back. Befriend WOMEN and take it slow. Don't dump emotional baggage on them, no one NEEDS to know that you are trying to be celibate. It's none of their business. Throw yourself into the church. Every reason you cited for leaving the church, every excuse you had has been wiped away for you. You will NEVER fit in with the more liberal aspect of society because you are too conservative. You don't fit in with LGBT+ because you are not one of them. You won't be trusted or respected by the church if you keep running your mouth about your sex experience or problems or (very slightly) left wing views. Those are things you keep to yourself! You don't have to run over to the nearest women's clinic and pray the rosary at people or pay a priest to perform an exorcism over a Gay Pride parade, you just simply keep your thoughts and opinions quiet so that you can live your celibate life undisturbed. For those who think you're too world-worn, that's THEIR problem. Mary Magdalene herself had seven demons cast out of her and she went on to be one of the first female evangelists!
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A
female
reader, mystiquek + ♥, writes (11 June 2023):
 I wish you had a close friend of a family member that you could talk to because more than anything it seems to me that you need someone that you can talk to and confide in, someone that won't judge you, someone that you could trust. I am not a therapist or a counsellor but I think maybe a sex therapist could help you sort out your feelings? I don't know anyone that is asexual but I can imagine how it must feel in the world where so much is geared towards sex. It must be very confusing. I dated a man that I truly believe was asexual even though I'm sure he would never admit to it. He was just happy to be with me and talk and chat and do things together but he could have cared less if we ever had sex. He was an attractive caring very intelligent man and he told me that he loved me and I believe that he did but I constantly felt hurt and rejected by his lack of interest in sex. I just don't think it interested him in the slightest but I needed more than he could give. It was a hurtful relationship for both of us even though we truly cared for each other. You are what you are and there's nothing wrong with that.
Have you tried searching online for groups for people that are asexual? There must be plenty of people that could understand your feelings but you need to search for them. People that truly could relate to you and what you've been through and welcome you, not shun you.
The world is a lonely place when you don't feel like you fit in. I urge you to seek out help. Its out there..you just have to look for it. Don't give up!
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