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writes: Hello, all. I regularly give advice here, and now I need help myself...In short, how do I let go of the fact that my life partner and myself may never get married? I am in an extremely happy, close (when I let it be, more to come on that), fantastic-fit relationship with the man of my dreams. We live together, share everything, co-parent his beautiful 6-year-old boy, and he treats me like I'm his wife, and the love of his life. We are best friends, and communicate on everything. The problem is, I was socialized in the very religious South where if a girl isn't married, she's nothing. And I do give advice here and regularly read the answers of other aunts, who all seem to be in the modern mindset of "the ring is everything." I get where they're coming from with those particular questioners, but in part, being around this mindset, that I grew up with, has me doubting and casting aspersions DAILY on my own relationship, simply because my partner isn't sure he believes in legal marriage anymore. A fight on this today ended with him yelling that he sure as hell doesn't want to marry me NOW. It's not like we've been together for 7 years or anything; it's just under 18 months. When I let the issue rest and just enjoy him, myself, our little guy, and the relationship, he regularly says that he looks forward to marrying me, being my husband, etc. etc. But when I press the issue and get weird on it (melodramatically talking about how I'll be sad as I'm on my deathbed, as my children ask, "Why did you and Dad never get married?" or saying in an obviously falsely sincere voice, "Boyfriend and girlfriend forever!! Marriage doesn't matter to me!! I promise!", and otherwise being melodramatic and fake, and completely ignoring the man, protector, lover, he already is), he runs the other way fast as can be. I'm not sure why I go crazy on this issue sometimes. We are essentially a married couple anyway, and for him, an atheist essentially from birth and having grown up in a liberal home, he genuinely doesn't get why I think things would be any different if we were married. I'm guessing that my own truth is that I don't really care either. I always wanted to meet the love of my life and spend my life with him, and I AM ALREADY DOING THAT. My mother is incredibly religious and thinks I'm "living in sin," and my dad is also old-fashioned, and while also an atheist, he believes that marriage is a higher form of commitment and wouldn't live with his girlfriend without being married (although he is always careful to say he doesn't judge me). I suspect that my desire to get legally married is to legitimize myself in their eyes. I think it's important to say that this isn't just another boyfriend. This is the man I was single for seven years for. This is my love. This is the man who taught me how to love, the only one who has seen all of me, whom I want. The ubiquitous advice to exchange this male for another that is "more aligned with my values" is not applicable here, I believe, because we do share all the same values. We are pretty damn good for each other.I also suspect that if I can just let this issue go, and let him come to it himself, 4 or 5 years will not go by but we'll be married anyway. The issue is just to RELAX into the relationship and allow him to feel that I want to be with HIM, not just an engagement-marriage-minivan-white-picket-fence machine. So, aunts (more specifically, uncles, because I want male advice on what they'd like to see in a life partner to want to marry her), how the heck do I chill out? Can I hear some strategies?
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female
reader, chigirl  +, writes (22 November 2013):
 So, it's been a few days, but all I could think of saying was something you don't want to hear. Yet, it's stuck to my mind for several days now, and I think maybe it needs to be said:
No man is worth giving up your hopes and dreams for. I've said this before to many women, and you need to know this as well. Even if you think he's worth giving it up for.. he never will be. No man is worth giving up your hopes and dreams for.
You probably have to learn this the hard way, like I did.
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female
reader, So_Very_Confused  +, writes (18 November 2013):
 OP do you think in 5 years when you are still not married you will be able to up and leave?
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male
reader, anonymous, writes (18 November 2013): Stop pressuring him , the way you're brining it up is so unattractive . When he wants to he will, but I pushed the date back two weeks everytime my girl pressured me.
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female
reader, sugarplum786  +, writes (18 November 2013):
 Honey, you say it does not matter whether he marries you, but you do care what people think and especially your parents. My counter argument to if the relationship living together is so great why don't just formalise it. As much as people are happy to be in a live in relationship, a marriage gives especially a woman a sense of commitment and the added responsibility to make relationship work.
The questions is do u want to be a live in partner or his wife? If its the wife, then as much as you respect his views and willing to wait, he should respect your view and give you an indication of when he thinks he would be ready to marry you.
Ultimately, you need to decide whether you want to sacrifice what you want just to be in a relationship with him and also does he not think you worth giving you what you want. Woman generally give into what men want because we love them so much, but trust me it always bothers us and wish they loved us enough to give us everything we want. For now you maybe okay, but when it comes to mind you cannot let go hence the fight you are having with him.
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reader, anonymous, writes (18 November 2013): One important often-overlooked point to consider: Without marriage you have no legal standing as "co-parent" in the child's life so should he have an accident or medical emergency while in your care you would be unable to give consent for treatment (and absent a health-care proxy, neither would you have any say should boyfriend suffer a sudden critical illness or injury).
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reader, anonymous, writes (17 November 2013): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionOh, about the "7 years" thing, I did not literally wait for him for 7 years. I am just that picky. The 7 years was my entire adult life, when I could have theoretically been in a relationship, but any potentials that came sniffing around just didn't feel right, and I refuse to go for it unless my gut tells me yes. So from 18-25 I was single, single, single. The most I ever did was kiss a friend and go on two dates with a professor who was very witty and fashionable, but whom the thought of kissing kinda turned me off...so never mind any of that. My sweet man is the person I was waiting for those 7 years when I couldn't find anyone I was compatible with. You have to know me and know how obscenely picky I am and how bizarre and complex my psyche is to know that for this guy to even BE my boyfriend, the heavens have to open up and I have to get a clear "yes" from my heart. Like I said, he is not an interchangeable, disposable male. The cards are stacked strongly in favor of me finding a way to rewire my brain rather than leaving him because he isn't sure he wants to marry again.
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reader, anonymous, writes (17 November 2013): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionAlso wanted to say that our relationship is very egalitarian and I do not feel used for childcare or housework...we split everything 50-50, and I do not take care of his son unless I explicitly ask him to and tell him I want to, even if he has his son at times that are highly inconvenient for him, and I'm at the hot tub reading a book. I don't do it unless I volunteer. He cooks more than I do (way more...I'm trying to improve here) and we split bills 50/50, with each of us bailing the other out if we run out of money/food. So far we've both been the monetary bailees. We both work full-time, and he makes only a teensy bit more than I do. We leased a house together, and we're both on the lease. So no, I'm not free domestic help. Thanks to those who truly did give me reasons to embrace not being married for the time being. Obviously no one here knows me, but the implication in my question was that he IS worth changing my socialization for, and I wanted to figure out how to do that. The goal being that I enjoy my daily life with him not obsessing over marriage, and if he proposes, great! If he doesn't, no biggie.
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female
reader, anonymous, writes (17 November 2013): Stop wasting time. If he doesn't want to get married and you do then this is a big mismatch. Clealrly marriage is a huge deal to both of you but in opposite regards. If he didn't feel strongly against it he wouldn't dig his heels in. If you didn't want it so strongly you wouldn't be pushing for it and getting upset at him.Unfortunately every time you push him or create conflict with him over it, you are reinforcing his negative feelings about marriage. He already felt it was a bad thing. Now you are proving him right that even talking about it leads to conflict, you don't event have to be married!Sorry to say but you really should move on from him if you value marriage and he doesn't.Personally I don't. I think it gives people rights to each others assets which is a good thing if one partner is trying to be selfish. But it can also cause one partner to become selfish. I seen my grandpa and my uncle taken to the cleaners by their ex wives in divorce court and I think it totally unfair. Divorce courts usually favor the wife. Maybe that's why its mainly women who want to get married? That and the fact that in society unmarried women are stigmatized but unmarried men not so much. Its a heavy burden to bear if you let it get to you. If you stay together but not married I would look into drawing up a legal contract stating how assets are to be divided in the event of the relationship breaking up. That is not being callous because that is what a marriage does, it is a legal contract designed to give people rights to another person's property or to stake a claim of ownership of assets acquired when you were with that person. Also I would ask a lawyer what happens to the assets if one of you dies.
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female
reader, anonymous, writes (17 November 2013): If all your friends decided they will never get married Eben though they are living the life of married couples and have been for years, would you feel more ok about not getting married?If you had positive role models all around you lot non-married but permanent family relationships would you feel more ok not getting married? If you knew elderly couples who have been together 50 years and have kids and grandkids and the tradition thanksgivings and chriatmases BUT they are not legally married, would you feel more ok?I guess I am wondering what is missing for you that will be fulfilled by the SAME person if only he would sign a piece of paper. You don't need that piece of paper to be with someone, to love them or to make a life with them. You don't need that piece of paper to buy property with them or have and raise kids with them.To me, you ARE married in spirit if he has chosen you to be the one he spends the rest of his life with.signing a piece of paper does not make that any more real. He doesn't want to sign the paper because he has seen how it can be used against him. Does that mean he distrusts you as he thinks you'll do the same? Not necessarily. He simply feels the whole institution of marriage obviously doesn't hold water or have anything to do with love or loyalty (otherwise he wouldn't have felt the need to divorce her) and that it can be used to screw someone over. Its actually pretty reasonable that he wouldn't support the institution of marriage. And if he doesn't support something ideologically, why would he agree to do it? If he would advise his friends not to get married why would he do it himself?I even think that a long term committed relationship without marriage is MORE pure than one that has a legal marriage license attached. When someone cam walk away from you anytime easily, you know they are staying with you because they want to and not because they are just trying to avoid legal consequences of breaking a contract. I advise you to leave him alone on this issue, or to leave the relationship. You shouldn't force someone to do something that they are against. If you love the idea of marriage more than you love the idea of being with him then he isn't the right guy for you. You need to find someone who also values marriage. Yes this is a clash of values and ideology.you have the option of changing your approach to this issue. If you don't want or cant give up your way of thinking about what marriage means, then how can you expect to change the way another person thinks and feels about it? It is best to end this relationship and find a more compatible partner. Why tint an uphill battle indefinitely.
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reader, So_Very_Confused +, writes (17 November 2013):
But marriage DOES matter to you... and by saying you want to let it go you are doing yourself a disservice.
I have been married FOUR TIMES and every time the guy knew between 3 and 6 months he wanted to marry me...
my son is dating a girl now he's dating her six months... and yet he seems to already know there will be an "eventual marriage"
my dad has been with his partner 18 YEARS.. he said he would never marry her and he has not. and he won't. BUT in their case, they were in their 60s and it was about the difficulties of combining large financial bases and screwing up their children's inheritances that prevented it partially... and partially as my father felt re-marrying after my mother's death was dishonorable to the only woman he ever loved.
IF you are ok not being married with this man then you are fine... but I'm betting that even if you back off on it, in 3-5 years it will be the same thing.... he does not wish to get married.... you will...
and yes the kids will ask look at Brad and Angelina... he's said "we don't need to be married but we are getting married because OUR KIDS want us married"
While we don't NEED to be married... we WANT it for many reasons... I think marriage shows a commitment to a relationship that just "shacking up" does not.
There was a song many years ago and a line in it went "pack it up, shacking up's all you wanna do"
I think if you love this man enough to give up your dream of being a wife you might consider finding a therapist to help you work it through.
As a woman right now running a home with a child that is not biologically yours, being treated as a wife and mother without the accompanying safety net and the glory of the ring and a piece of paper you would have to give that up as he has no impetus to marry you since he already has what he needs/wants.
As much as I hate cliches "why buy the cow when the milk is free" really does apply here...
If he owns your home, if he makes more money, If you care for his child instead of working full time, HE would LOSE financially if you marry....
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reader, anonymous, writes (17 November 2013): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionHi, chigirl, we've been together 18 months, not 7 years! I said it's NOT like we've been together 7 years :) if we had and were still not married, I would be gone.One positive thing is that I am not catching crap for it all the time, because we live in a liberal hippie desert town where "partners" are way more common than husbands and wives. I am determining whether I find marriage important, or my socialization tells me it is. I had just fled the cult I grew up in when I met him, and he had literally just signed his divorce papers (to a woman he proposed to after 5 months, and stayed in an unhappy marriage with for 10 years), so yes, we both have opposing crap to get over. We have made a lot of progress, and I'm not just sitting here trying to deny my true feelings...I think my true feelings can honestly, really, go either way. When I don't talk to my mom and I don't go on this site as much and see that I'm a cow whose milk is being taken for free, I really 100% don't give a shit. I have a man who loves me, treats me very well, and wants to support me and build a life with me. Also, weddings -- the thought if walking down the aisle in a white dress makes me want to puke. I'd much rather elope.That being said, there will come a time 4 or 5 years down the line or so when I will present him with a marriage license and tell him to sign the damn thing. For now, I am happy being his de facto wife and chilling out, letting him come to the conclusion on his own...and he does want it, when I don't harass him, he talks about marriage and being excited about it on his own. The advice I was hoping to get was strategies on how to chill enough to give him the space to do this...not the "leave him" advice...it hasn't even come to that yet. Nowhere close.
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reader, chigirl +, writes (17 November 2013):
I'm a bit on the fence here. In itself, marriage doesn't have to be important if both parties feel the same way. Say, if you didn't want to be married because you saw no point in it yourself. You could still find it difficult to stand up to your family, but if it wasn't something YOU wanted then you'd feel like you were getting support from your boyfriend in this decision, and the decision would be YOURS.
But, the decision right now isn't yours. It's not yours combined either, as in something the two of you agreed on together. Right now, you're going along with what HE wants. And your wants, your dreams, your hopes, are being placed as less important. Or not important enough.
Look at it this way. He is so important to you that you waited 7 years for him (Although I do wish to know why. Was he married? Were you his mistress?). He is so important to you that you gave him your virginity, DESPITE you wanting to give this to your future husband. This was your way to commit to him. You also express your desire to commit to him by living with him WITHOUT being married, which goes against something that sits really deep for you.
So, I wonder, what has he done to show his commitment to you? If nothing, then I am sorry to say but it sounds like he just isn't as interested in you as you are in him, and that this is a one sided thing. And if that's true, then things will not get better later on. On the contrary, things will get worse, because you will resent him, and he KNOWS this. Yet your happiness isn't so important to him, the happiness of the relationship isn't as important to him, because he values his freedom and NOT committing more.
But, this scenario doesn't have to be true. He might not want to marry out of equally important (to him) reasons as the ones you have for getting married. If by marriage you are looking for commitment, you can see if he has committed to you in other ways. Financially, have you bought a house together, or gotten tied up together otherwise? If he passes away, will you inherit? Has he written a will? Have you signed a contract for couples who live together outside of marriage? There are such contracts, and I highly recommend you sign one.
I don't think it is wrong at all to want marriage in order to get approval of your family/society. If that is the reason you want to be married. There are many reasons why someone would want marriage, but you mentioned this as maybe being your reason. I don't see it as wrong at all. We care about what out families think of us, and family is important. For some people it isn't, but for others family is everything. To not care what they feel about you, or to not care that they think you live in sin.. You'd be a rather cold and distant person if you're not affected by that.
I don't think the ring is everything, I respect that some people do not want to marry. But I see the point in wanting to get approval of family and society. When I was dating my boyfriend without us being officially together EVERYONE, friends, family, even random strangers who heard about it, would feel a need to COMMENT on it, and express how foolish I was, and express how dumb I was, and express how little he cared about me if he didn't make it official. It's actually bullying, judging, and right out mean. It's none of everyone else's business what I do. Same as it isn't anyones business whether or not you and your boyfriend are married. But if people around you are like people around me, they sure make it their business!
If people around you didn't care so much, or express that they think you live in sin, you might not care either. You might not even want to be married then either. But people do comment, they do put their noses in your business. You get judged, you get looked down upon by your own family (if they think you live in sin). I can imagine that is rough! I was tired and extremely annoyed by all the comments I got for not being in an official relationship, I can imagine what you must hear from your friends and family.
So yes, you can fight it and all the comments and all the looks, but only if you actually DON'T want to marry. But you do! It's him who doesn't want to be married. So right now, you're fighting HIS battle for him, and having to fake wanting what he wants so as to not come off as weak and used and be "pitied". He's not getting the shit you get for not being married, but you have to face it.
I told my boyfriend about these comments and questions from others, but he didn't understand. We have talked about it afterwards too, and he never got pressured the way I was. It's something about it being more acceptable for men to not get serious, they're so called "bachelors", but somehow women are seen as losers if they "cant get a man to commit". I got comments and questions from just about everyone, while he didn't. He didn't experience a difference from when we were just dating, and to when we put a label on it and made it official. But I noticed a HUGE difference. First off, people respect my relationship now. They didn't respect it before. Even my best friend would refer to my boyfriend as my "fuck-friend" when we were just dating (without even knowing whether we slept together or not). Can you imagine? I snapped at her for that one and she never said it again, but it just illustrates how others didn't respect my relationship before we made it official and to the "standard" of society. Now, after making it official, somehow my friends are all happy for me, and people I meet are happy for me. While before we made if official it was as if they pitied me! If I said I was just dating someone, they'd always follow up with "why don't you make it official" or "why are you wasting your time on him" etc. I'd have to defend my choices over and over and over.
If you're getting any of the same treatment, I totally understand it. Getting married then WOULD make a HUGE difference to you. Maybe not to him, because he doesn't get stigmatized the same, he doesn't get the questions and comments. But to you it'd make a big difference. Maybe you should try to explain that to him. Although my boyfriend never understood it, because he never experienced that. But at least, he understood that there was a difference and that being official was a bigger deal for me than for him, as in people treating me differently whereas for him it didn't have any consequence.
Phew, this became a long post! Let me make my conclusion so far. I think you need to sort out what exactly you feel about this. Do you feel pressure by family and friends to be married? If yes, then don't ridicule it, because such pressure can really take a toll on you. It's hard in itself, but it's worse if you actually agree with them and think yourself that you should be married. Then it just feels like you are "punished" by friends and family for not doing what they want you to do, despite YOU wanting it. You're taking your boyfriends punishment in his place. It's unfair, and makes you feel like crap. This isn't something you can "suck up and get over". Not until your family stops thinking you live in sin. If your boyfriend wants you to stop feeling the way you do about marriage then he first needs to stop your family from thinking you live in sin! How likely is it he can do that?
Second, find out why it is you want marriage, in and for itself. Imagine your family didn't care. What does marriage mean to you? Talk to your boyfriend about what marriage means to him. I think you and him need to find common ground on this, you are a team. If you are going to stand by his side in not being married, and standing up to family and friends and essentially fight his battle for him, then you need to know you agree on this. You need to find common ground. Will you eventually marry? What is marriage to the two of you? How do you see your future? Get a common ground that you agree on.
Next, try to tell him how your day looks like when you talk to family and friends so that he can understand the pressure you are under. You probably get questions, just like I did. Talk to him about how to answer these questions without you having to lie. You can't answer a question "Why are you not married" or "Will you be married" with a lie and say "I don't want it". You actually need to be able to say "He doesn't want it, and we do not agreed on this, and maybe I will end up leaving him because he doesn't want to marry me, at least not yet". Of course, you can't tell people that! But that's the truth, isn't it? So your boyfriend should help you formulate an answer that is truthful, yet doesn't give off too much detail.
Lately people have been asking me if me and my boyfriend will move in together. I wanted it for 9 months already. He was on the fence. I decided to just stop faking it and stop trying to look perfect in everyones eyes. It's none of their business actually, so I could have just said "it's private". But instead I answered "We don't live together because he isn't sure if he's ready". Simple as that. Then people would stop asking, lol.
Do write and update and tell me more about how this unfolds, I feel like I'm in the same boat. I think all women find themselves in this boat actually, society does put a ton of pressure on us to find a man and be married or else we are "failures" whereas men get to do whatever they want without judgment.
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female
reader, anonymous, writes (17 November 2013): What do you believe will change or be different if you two were married? That's really the crux of the issue isn't it?Well one bong that will change is that you will feel less stigmatized and judged by your family and social circle. Wanting to be accepted socially can be a big thing that affects you.Another difference is a legal one. Married couples can share health insurance benefits and in the events of death or break up of the relationship it can mean the difference in how much money and material assets you walk away with. To me that is really the only thing that changes for the better when you get married. Something that changes for the worse is that break ups become more expensive and messy (divorce). No longer can you just part gracefully instead the court of law must OK it. But since you don't plan to break up this should he a moot point.Just remind yourself that the divorce rate is 50%. That should make it very clear that getting married in no way shape or form solidifies a relationship or innocuates it against falling apart in the future. It does not in any way shape or form indicate a person's loyalty or commitment. If a willingness to marry indicated a higher level of commitment or character then few people would ever get divorced. So really, why the snider remarks to your bf about staying unmarried? Your error in thinking is in equating marriage with permanence or higher commitment when clearly it does not have any correlation. He fact that he doesn't want marriage means that he believes it is a negative thing. Do you understand what his beliefs about marriage are? Do you understand why he fears marriage? Or has your desire for marriage blinded you to his point of view? He isn't wanting to avoid marriage just so he can keep his options open and not commit. He can marry you and renege on his commitment anytime via a divorce (remember again the divorce rate is 50%). Love and commitment and loyalty exist independently of marriage. So maybe for you it does boil down to wanting to feel accepted by your family and peers. Traditionally marriage is how couples identify themselves as "being together" since you have all this symbolism pike rings and changing your last name to his (I didn't when I got married by the way. I got married because I was young and stupid and didn't even consider it was possible NOT to get married.) So maybe take a moment and imagine whether you would still desire marriage so much if all these symbols were no longer practiced in society. If it became the norm for married people not to wear rings or share the same last name - if there was no way to tell outwardly if two people were legally married to each other and all you have left is the actual RELATIONSHIP rather than the symbols of it - would you still desire marriage so badly? I have a feeling that you might not since this goes with the validation thing.... wanting to fit in with the crowd is normal and I do acknowledge it can be a very distressing problem to always feel judged as being "lesser than". But at the same time I think while the "easy" solution is to just cave in and do what will gain you acceptance (I.e. get married, or for other people it is having kids when they don't particularly want kids but because it is expected of them) it isn't the only solution. You could work on removing or lessening your need for validation from these people in this area of life. Depending on what is stronger - your need for their validation or your desire to be with this man - one or the other solutions will he more teneble.
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female
reader, YouWish +, writes (17 November 2013):
 Hmm.
The way you phrased the 6-year old as "his" kid - does that mean it's his kid from a different mother? Because if that's the case, you can't refer to him as "our" kid.
If that is his kid from another mom, it sounds like he got burned by someone else. Either way, you do realize why he isn't rolling out the M word for you, right? Because you give him everything without it. You're co-raising his kid, doing the whole domestic thing, and you know full well that domestic doesn't equal commitment.
Also, you said this: "I was socialized in the very religious South where if a girl isn't married, she's nothing".
Why hang up on that now? The "very religious" South means you shouldn't be living together, having sex, raising someone else's kid, and a whole bunch of other things.
I also disagree that marriage is a foregone conclusion if you just "cool off". On the contrary. What benefit does he have by marrying you if you're giving him everything now? The truth is, he has it all, because you've already gone all in, so what incentive is there?
You've been together a year and a half, and not being married yet isn't uncommon at that mark, but if he doesn't believe in marriage, it doesn't bode well for you. I think in the end, you'll have to make the choice whether you want to be married, or used up by him until your looks and your dreams and your youth wear out in a pool of resentment.
I don't mean to be cynical, but you've already thrown it all in with him, and you've already crossed all Southern Religious credos by becoming sexual and living with him. And if he's still letting his ex stunt all of his relationships, he's got too much baggage.
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reader, Honeypie + ♥, writes (17 November 2013):
 I think you have to follow you heart and you HAVE to be honest with him and ACCEPT HIS choice too, because MAYBE this is something that means you two REALLY aren't as compatible as you want you two to be.
My brother and Sister-in-law were together for 18 years before they got married. In my home country marriage it's the BEST legal way to ensure that your partner/spouse is taken care of and GET the money/house/cars whatever without having to pay a hefty tax. The biggest reason though, was their two kids. The kids wanted to know WHY they weren't married. And honestly (like they put it, they couldn't really give a good reason NOT to marry) So they had a small ceremony and got hitched.
I am not a "OMG I HAVE to be married!!" girl either. I don't think it's living in SIN, but I'm not a Christian so there goes that. I would have been happy to just LIVE together with my partner, but I DO think ONCE you decide to bring children in, MARRIAGE DO make a difference. We got married because that was the logical and practical solution for us.
I think YOU need to figure out what you DEADLINE is. If marriage is something you WANT and NEED from him, then I think it's fair enough to let him know. How you feel and what YOUR time line is. HIS might not be the same, so you two MIGHT have to negotiate. But I also think it's REALLY unfair that he make YOU "pay" for his past failed marriage. And I think it's EVEN more unfair that he holds it over you head as some kind of blackmail. That is really a low blow. Controlling and down right mean.
Now if a guys says, I don't know if I will ever marry again and you are PRO marriage, then you need to consider that it might never happen. So HE might not BE for you.
Same with kids/no kids. I have heard of guys who will date and marry a girl - she already KNOWS he doesn't want kids, but she ASSUMES because he marries her that he will change his mind. UNFAIR of her. IF she wants kids and he doesn't, well then you need to decide if it is a deal-breaker or not. SAME goes for marriage.
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reader, anonymous, writes (17 November 2013): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionYeah, I would. :) I think it is neat that in medieval Europe, it was a legitimate form of 'taking a woman to wife' to simply get it on -- to consummate the union. That is how I viewed my virginity, and I gave it to him.
I have told him that I would be okay with a commitment ceremony, an elopement (the first time either of us will have traveled out of the country), and just calling each other husband/wife (which we already do, occasionally). It's just the societal trappings that are really tripping me up.
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female
reader, Intrigued3000  +, writes (17 November 2013):
 I have a friend who has been living with her boyfriend for a decade now. They have two kids, a home, a dog, two vehicles. He is a good provider, loves her very much and takes good care of his family. The only issue that has nearly killed their relationship, is the fact that he does not want to get married. This has been a dream of hers. She left him a couple of times, but always came back, because she realized that she can't find a better man. She loves him, but she still carries that bitter seed of resentment in her. I think it has affected her ability to love him wholeheartedly throughout the years. She confided in me that she thinks it is selfish of him to deny her that dream.
My parents would be considered illegitimate according to law, because when my grandparents (both sides) got married, they had the lavish ceremony with a priest, exchanged rings, guests, reception, etc, but they never registered. It was the custom back then in my culture. I guess you can call it a commitment ceremony.
Would you be willing to compromise and have a commitment ceremony instead?
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