A
female
age
41-50,
*do309
writes:I'm going to be really honest. I had been with my bf for 3 years. All of our relationship, I introduced my bf to my family and friend but my bf never introduce me to any of his friends or family except only to his son, 6 yr old. He got divorce once. He always said that he can't promise me anything for our future because he didn't want to get divorce again. At the end of our 3 year relationship, we started having problems, argued and it got worse and worse, he made me feel that he didn't love me anymore. he abused me verbally when we fought. I felt selfishness from him, he always say he want this, he want that but careless about what I need. A couple months before that, there is another guy coming into my life, he was trying to go out with me and he seemed like a really nice guy. I thought that it would be better if I just leave my bf. So I chose to break up with my bf and try to have a relationship with a new guy. but it didn't work out that way. Almost 2 months after the break up, I got together with the new guy, but he couldn't replace my bf, I can't help it but comparing things between them. I missed my bf a lot. During 5-6 months after the break up, my life was just a mess. I wanted to come back to my bf, we tried many times but I still kept the relationship with the new guy. I don't know why I did that. I didn't mean to be two timer, I know it was bad. The new guy wasn't serious with me and my bf found out about it. I broke the relationship with the new guy completely couple months ago. I'm still with my bf until now, we are trying to work things out. When we are together, we are very happy. But when he's aways from me,bad memories keep coming back to him. My bf always said that I cheated on him. Last month my bf hit me couple times when he got drunk because he was so mad at me about what happened. but I still want to be him after all. I know this sounds really bad. He never hit me before this happening, I'm afraid that once he hit me, he will hit me again in the future. The problem is during the time that we had problems, there are 2 girls coming into his life too. Right now, he says to me that he wants to go out with them to find out if he still want me, he probably told them that he is not in relationship or having problem with me, I don't know. but he doesn't want to break up with me yet. If he's sure for fact that they are better than me, he will leave me. I don't know what to do.I still want to work things out but knowing for fact that I'm not the only one, it is very hard. My bf said that I always still be in heart, even bad memories come back, he can't forget me. But he keep listen to other people, friends, they told him to break up with me because I will do this to him again but I know I won't. My questions are, if I decide to stay with him, how can I convince him that he can trust me, how can I handle he's going out with other girls? But If I let him go, will there be any chance that he will find out that he love me and come back to me? What is the best solution? Any advice?
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female
reader, jdo309 +, writes (20 March 2009):
jdo309 is verified as being by the original poster of the questionTo troubledtoomuch, he did divorced his wife. I was the first woman that he dated after the divorced around 9 months. So he did have enough break. They were married for 5 years. I went to his wife place with him just to drop his son off after we spent time with him, of course I didn't not meet his wife, we just stay outside. They don't live together. Yes, he does has two brothers, the one living with him also divorced.
A
female
reader, jdo309 +, writes (20 March 2009):
jdo309 is verified as being by the original poster of the questionAfter I broke up with my bf, he was devasted too. He learnt that I was part of everything he does in his life. Everything he touched, it included me. Yes, Tisha-1 , he does change, during our difficual time, he showed me that he can give too. But he's still verbally abusive. And he still doesn't let me meet his parents and friends because I cheated on him.
My bf gave me many chances to get back together eventhough he know that I physically involved with the new guy. a few months that I got physically involved and a couple months after that I kept in touch. During those time, I was also trying to get back with my bf. I lied to him because I thought it was best for him not to know and I eventually would come back to him 100%. I am come back 100% now but it almost likely too late. I was not honest to my bf before about this new guy. I didn't come up to him and tell him first like his ex wife did. He has to find out one way or another. That's why he was so angry.
I was raised in strick family, my parents are still together but not really happy with their marriage. They stay together because me and brothers. They both busy working trying raise us. I often heard they argued, only once that it gone bad. I think I has problem being honest because since I got scared of punishment from my parents when I was young. I rather keep to myself than bother other poeple. Often times, I end up found myself in difficult situations because I didnt want to tell. I never post in here before, this is my first time Tisha-1. you know a bit about me now. Its really ok to say both bad and good about me. I'm really open to any opinions.
For last couple months, sometimes I felt stupid, I had to admit that it was my fault when deep down inside I don't think so, part of it is his fault. I told my mom, my friends that it was my fault. Nobody knows that he hit me. I don't want to make my family worry. I don't want my friends to look at him differently. What about if we finally end up together. I want them to think he is a good person. He has good sides too.
He tells many people about what I did, his coworkers, friends and ask their opinion. I'm sure that he told them his side of story. They all said that I am a bad person, I cheated on him and he should leave me. he said once a cheater, always a cheater. Just I don't think I am a cheater. I wanted to break up with him and be in another relationship, that was really my intention.
I let him went though my personal stuffs, email, cell phone. I try to be a better person for myself and for him, being honest to everyone. I cut no contact whatsoever with male friends eventhough they are just friends because I didn't want him to have a wrong idea.
I just has to find out that during our relationship, he was not completely honest with me. He gave his lady cowoker who he know that she was interested in him a ride home and other place few times, without telling me. They had been talked without me knowing. I just found out because he slipped out his month, he thought he told me.
Right now, when we try to work things out, he keeps mentioning there are 2 attractive women who are willing to go out with him. Making him wonder what would be like to go out with them. I know that he has been contacting them constantly and has gone out for dinner with one of them. It made me crazy. When I brought it up, he got angry and said that it can't be compared to what I did.
I really don't know what to do with him anymore. Whatever he wants to do. I quit my job just a couple weeks ago, part of it is I let my personal life affect my work, I can't perform 100%. I just start my new job this week and I am afraid that as long as I am still in this emotional mess, has no solution, I would have to quit again.
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reader, anonymous, writes (20 March 2009): Quote: "If you read carefully, I actually complemented you on your "upgrade"."
I did read your response carefully and did notice the complement. For that I give you a belated thank you. However, you did ask the question about the meaning of dating, so I answered it. I also throw in the reasons why for the benefit of understanding of varying opinions. Yes, we probably slept with some who we shouldn't have, but others were definitely beneficial to both of us and not just for the fun of it.
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reader, anonymous, writes (20 March 2009): Are you sure that he is not still married and it is not his wife who is inside the apartment? If I were living with my brother (don't have one, but if) I don't think that would prevent me from allowing my girlfriend into the apartment. Is it possible that he is still with his wife and that they have an open marriage and allow each other to date others? The fact that you have never met his brother makes me wonder if he actually has one. I certainly can't tell what the truth is, but I find this behavior very strange.
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female
reader, wonderingcat  +, writes (20 March 2009):
 Troubledtoomuch : LOL
This is not about you, this is about the OP
If you read carefully, I actually complemented you on your "upgrade".
And I did not criticize you either on your "dating other people", I merely said "I don't know his definition of dating".
I could go on to respond/comment on your reaction, but chose not to. It is not about you, nor me, nor star. It is about jdo309, the original poster.
LMAO
Cat
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female
reader, jdo309 +, writes (20 March 2009):
jdo309 is verified as being by the original poster of the questionI might post my update dupplicate because i thought it didn't went through, sorry if that happens.
To Tisha-1, thanks for you answer.I can tell you more about us. my bf was divorce once and he told me since the begginning that it was more of his ex wife fault. His wife wanted to see another guy but she did tell him about it first. He tried to work it out for the sake of his son but they failed. I always wonder why his ex wanted to see other guy if there is nothing wrong with him.
During 3 years of our relationship,I actually never been inside his place because he didn't let me. I only met him outside his apartment. He gave me reasons that he is living with his brother and he used to live there with his ex wife before. so it was kind of their memories. i never met his brothers, his dad nor his friends. And I always ask him to introduce me to them, he just told me, it was not the time yet. He met my family only once becayse they live in other country. But he has been to my place and slept over many times. He always spent time with we, came to see me and stayed over. So I never doubt that he was not serious with me. When I ask about our future after passed couple years, he said that he has to focus on his career first, and he want to make sure if he get married again, he will never get divorce. So he told me he couldn't promise me anything. Because I love him, so whatever he said I told him I understand.
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reader, anonymous, writes (20 March 2009): Quote: "I am not sure I am in agreement with Troubledtoomuch with regards to "comparing other people". But I don't know what he and his wife's definition of "dating other people" is. If that meant, yes, going out to dinners, going out to the movies, hugs, kiss on the cheeks, that's fine. But if that meant, passsionate kissess and sex, well, that's a different issue altogether."
To answer your question, dating others meant all of the above, including sex. She was in her early 30s when she left her first husband and I was in my mid 30s by the time we started dating. All of our relationships involved talking, trying to understand the other person and sex. You might not agree with that, but we weren't teens at the time. Pecks on the cheek???? Common! I believe that a person can learn so much about one who they are dating during sex. Not to mention that it's fun. People tend to drop their guard during the passion of sex. My wife dated men who put on a good show, but once in bed with them, she quickly learned that all they cared about was their own sexual gratification. If they only care about their own orgasm, then it becomes obvious that they will eventually drop the show and not really care about their partner in other ways down the road. Yes, she slept with men who she wished she hadn't and I also did with one of the women who I slept with.
I was torn between her and another women about a year after we started dating. Both my wife and her were very nice women. I could have married either one. The other woman was better in bed, but the way my wife looked at me and held me as I held her after sex just screamed LOVE to me, and I was not wrong about her love for me. The way I cared about her and her enjoyment more than mine was also unique to her and showed her that I really cared for her. No fake shows were ever put on, just caring.
There were things that neither of us liked about the other, but the basics of love and caring show up real fast in bed. Weather people agree with us is of no importance to me. They have every right to disagree, but we feel it worked for us in the end, mistakes and all.
My wife dated other men before we started dating. She broke up with her current boyfriend the night after our first date. I dated other women after we started dating. There was no cheating involved. She encouraged it and she knew when I was dating someone else. That is all she knew - no details, but she was aware of what I was doing - no different than what we did.
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female
reader, wonderingcat +, writes (20 March 2009):
oopps ... correction on typo:
I wrote .... "an almost classic example of a person who had abused for a while"
should be: ..."an almost classic example of a person who had BEEN abused for a while"
Sorry about that.
(I'm wearing a band aid on the tip/nail of my right index finger .. kitchen accident) LOL
Cat
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female
reader, wonderingcat +, writes (20 March 2009):
OK. This is going to be as lomg as your posting. Forgive me.
Star hit the nail on the head by saying you have a bigger problem than the "comparing" other people through window shopping .. I mean, dating.
Your bf has already proven that he has upgraded his software from verbally abusive 1 to physically abuse 2 and now has a plug in software called emotionally abuse 3.
Unlike troubledtoomuch, instead of upgrading the software, he [and his wife] upgraded the operating system. The result of course, the programs/software that work on this new imprived OS are also running better.
Nuff techie talk.
Bottom line is, unfortunately, he has shown you his true abusive characteristics to you. And unfortunately, you also have shown an almost classic example of a person who had abused for a while. The main symptomps are of course "fear of losing the love of your life", "dependency and low self esteem" (e.g. I cannot cope without him), wrongly placed "tolerance" toward disrespect, etc etc etc.
You asked if he can be convinced to trust you again. To begin with, any "love" relationship (be it between two best friends, two lovers, or parents-children) has to be founded on respect. Trust is part of respect. They are an integral part of the relationship. You lose or break the respect (and/or trust), it takes years to mend it. Unless you get a rude awakening one day that makes you want to realize what the priorities should be in your life.
Your b/f has disrespected you (starting with the verbal abuse, then physical abuse, and now both emotional and verbal abuse together). Now, he broke your trust too by still "dating" other women.
I am not sure I am in agreement with Troubledtoomuch with regards to "comparing other people". But I don't know what he and his wife's definition of "dating other people" is. If that meant, yes, going out to dinners, going out to the movies, hugs, kiss on the cheeks, that's fine. But if that meant, passsionate kissess and sex, well, that's a different issue altogether.
Human beings are superior than the rest of the animal kingdom because we have a highly developed brain and a "heart". Again, interconnected and integral part of the way we live.
Animals sniff around each other's sexual glands/hormones to see which male/female has the better potential mate to carry the better genes for the next generation. (Well, we do, in a rudimentary sort of way). You only have to watch Animal Planet or any NatGeo/Discovery channels these days to learn about evolution/successive theories, and about "dominance" by staking their "territories".
You are also not a "thing" or an "item for sale" in a shop, where a "customer" goes around to different shops to compare prices and specs. You are also not a safety net, or a door mat. You are a human being with a heart/mind and a highly developed brain.
Wow, this is getting to be quite a "lecture" LOL
Anyways, back to basics. Love equals respect equals trust. If he loves you, he respects and trusts you. He does neither of the last two. Do you still believe he loves you???
You did not cheat on your boyfriend. You chose to be respectful of your b/f by breaking up with him. You also broke up with the other one before you got back to your current one. Your b/f telling you that you "cheated" on *him* is just another example of emotional abuse.
Should I go on? I should think not.
You don't want to go back to him. You don't want to see him "date" (i.e. passionate kiss, sex, spending excesive amouint of time with) other girls. You don't want him to belittle you. You don't want him to lie to you, You don't want him to hit you. Yes, those things will be your life if you do choose "do" instead of "don't".
What should you do? Forgive yourself, for the err in your ways to let him lead to believe that you are worthy of your b/f. Then forgive him, because he let his "demons" control his life. Then run! Run from him and never look back.
If you did look back, it is only to be thankful that it is all behind you and that you have been handed a valuable lesson in life.
Good luck and be strong. You deserve better than him.
Cat
Read up on these articles:
Abusive Behavior Checklist: Evaluate the Abuse Level in Your Past or Present Relationship http://www.cdh.org/ClinicalServices.aspx?id=9298
Warning Signs of an Abusive Personality http://www.hiddenhurt.co.uk/Abuser/signs.htm
28 Signs of Abusers http://organizations.rockbridge.net/projecthorizon/signsofabuser.htm
12 Signs of the abuser http://au.geocities.com/tigrispoet/12signs.htm
Domestic Violence Warning Signs of an Abuser http://www.mvwcs.com/redflag.html
How to Recognize The Signs Of An Abuser http://www.ehow.com/how_4511572_recognize-signs-abuser.html
There's more on the net :-(
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female
reader, jdo309 +, writes (20 March 2009):
jdo309 is verified as being by the original poster of the questionTo star, I agree with you that hitting is a big problem, I was scared for my life. It happened couple times when he was really really drunk, he didn't remember that he hit me the next day. I got black eye, bruised all over my body and a big bump as big as lemon on my forehead. He felt really bad to see my bruised and he apologized. He said his parents were never abusive to each other. But his mom passed away in car accident when he was in college, he's 41 years old now.
He has been drinking again but undercontrol, and he didn't touch me ever since. but it has been only couple months. Time to time,he verbally abuse me about what I did in the past.
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reader, anonymous, writes (20 March 2009): jdo309,
we are always here - let us know how it works out or if you just need a nudge now and again.
Star.x.
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female
reader, jdo309 +, writes (20 March 2009):
jdo309 is verified as being by the original poster of the questionI agree to both of you. I agree with star that hitting me is a big thing to consider. My bf he just hit me couple times, when he was really really drunk. He didn't remember anything next day. But I end up with black eye, bruises all over my body, and a bump as big as lemon on my forehead. He denied that he hit me. He said that he just tried to push me away because he was mad. He felt really bad to see all of my bruises. He said he was never an abusive person in his life.
After that he has been drinking again but within a limit, he told me that he will not hurt me again and he has never touched me ever since but it has been only couple of months. Time to time, he got angry about the past that I chose the other guy over him, he brought it up and verbally abused me. I can only hope that this will eventually go away, as we let time heal us. But it has been only couple of months. It is still fresh in his memory.
I can only hope that we can work things out like you , troubledtoomuch. Thanks again for both of you to help me.
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female
reader, Tisha-1 +, writes (20 March 2009):
 Hi, jdo, I see your dilemma. You love him and want him back, but he is angry with you and wants to see if there is someone better out there. Star and troubledtoomuch have given you great advice. I wanted to focus on something you said early on; and that is the original reason for the breakup. You were together for 3 years, and the only friend or family member he ever introduced you to has his son? Then he tells you that he cannot marry you because he is afraid of divorce? And then he starts putting his needs before yours and makes you feel unloved, and is abusive when you argue?
What I didn't hear from you was that your boyfriend ever wanted to change in order to get you back. It seems you were the one who wanted to get back into a relationship with this abusive, unloving, commitment-phobic man who kept you apart from the rest of his life.
You dated another man, and the mistake you made was not being honest with your boyfriend that you were seeing another man when you tried to reconcile. There is no call for physical violence, accusations of cheating and continuing to isolate you from the rest of his life.
Sweetheart, my concern for you is that you don't seem to have enough self-esteem to recognize that this man is treating you terribly. You don't deserve this, really and truly you do not.
What is it that makes you love him? His actions seem to speak much louder than his words to me. And they say, "I will stay with this woman until something better comes along."
So the original reason for the breakup is back again. He is putting his needs first and dismissing yours. He is verbally abusive. And he has added the ENORMOUS red flag of becoming physically abusive. He still has you removed from his friends, only now they call you a cheater. I would call what you did not telling him that you were also seeing another man. But does it deserve this level of violence and abuse? I think that once a man hits a woman, the next time is easier, and then it gets to seem almost normal. It is terribly wrong, but this is how these situations seem to get started.
Tell us about your parents and your family; did you have a happy childhood with stable parents? What sort of role model was your dad?
Please focus right now on his actions; there's no point in speculating on a relationship with him until these issues have been examined and truly resolved. The physical abuse, the verbal abuse, the isolation for the rest of his life, the fact that he feels the need to get even somehow for a lie of ommission. As Star says, his crime is much worse than yours.
Please take care of yourself.
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reader, anonymous, writes (20 March 2009): I agree with Star, but I have more thoughts on this situation. OK, so you broke up with him for another guy, hoping for a better relationship. You consider it a mistake, but perhaps it was not. You need different relationships to be sure that you are with the right person. My wife dated about 10 guys between leaving her first husband and only partner at the time and dating me. That gave her a significant point of comparison. Being able to compare me to those past boyfriends is what made her never want to leave me, even when we were having some marriage problems. By the way, we have been together for nearly 30 years. She never dated anyone after our 2nd date.
My first wife left me and she was the only serious relationship I ever had. My current wife was my first partner after that and she encouraged me to date other women. I dated 4 women, including my ex again, over about 2 years. My wife still thinks that encouraging me to date other women was one of the smartest decisions that she ever made. She knew that I was not happy with some of her behavior after she left her first husband and that she could lose me to someone else, but she also knew that I needed to be sure that I really wanted her for a long term partner. She thought the risk of losing me was much better than having another failed marriage.
Neither one of us has ever thought of leaving for someone else or wishing that we could be with someone else instead. We both made mistakes in relationships, including ours, but we have always worked our mistakes out. From your question, it appears that your situation with your boyfriend is somewhat similar to what my wife and I had early on.
If you want to stay with him then I think that you need to allow him to date other women. It appears that is what he needs right now, just as trying this other relationship is what you needed.
Now to the more serious problem - his hitting you. OK, he was drunk and perhaps he would never do that is sober, but there will always be the risk of him being drunk and doing it again. I have never hit my wife, but I did verbally abuse her some in the past. This was mostly criticizing her for something she had done. It was uncalled for and I was wrong. Fortunately for both of us, I realized what I was doing and stopped that behavior. I started to care more about her and less about me, so it is possible to change bad behavior. My wife has done it and so have I.
The main problem that you have to work out is him hitting you. If it happens again then I think that you have to break off this relationship. You have to make it very clear to him that you cannot allow this to continue. As far as I am concerned, you did not cheat on him. You broke up with him before you started the other relationship. Perhaps allowing him to date these other women will show him that you want him and are willing to give him the time to decide what he wants. If it helped you in your decision then it will help him decide who he wants. Being sure is always better than wondering if you could have done better.
Again, the most important thing is to resolve this hitting problem. It is possible for him to correct his problem, but he has to really want to do so. If not, the relationship is not worth it.
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reader, anonymous, writes (20 March 2009): you have a bigger problem - the hitting. NO excuse for it. we will come back to this.
your questions -
How to get him to trust you - time. And reassurance. the only ways. No it does not mean you will do it again.
yes there is a chance he will come back. If he does forgive you - which if he loves you, he has to, But that doesn't mean he will forget.
ok now the hitting....
This is a big red alarm message to me. I would not go back on that basis alone - no excuse. you owe to yourself not to go there. His Crime is by far bigger than yours.
Please see this post: http://www.dearcupid.org/question/he-abuses-me-slightlybut-breaking-up-is-really.html
Star.x.
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