A
female
age
22-25,
*5sweetnsingle
writes:I am a big fan of classic period dramas and books such as Pride and Prejudice and North and South. I love how women are treated in this era and how men are respectable gentlemen. I know i am not alone in this thought and that many women love this period for its romance etc. The closest i have got to finding a gentleman these days is a man holding open a door for me.What i want to know is this - do gentlemen still exist in the modern world - or are todays men not tough thow to be polite and courteous to women anymore?? I would like to hear from both men and women on this? Anyone name some examples of encounters with gentlemen??
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male
reader, SyferFire  +, writes (6 June 2009):
 Quirklady,
Well.. then I have lost track of what we are even arguing about. Oh that's right. You started with a post I found mildly offensive, then in reaction to my most appropriate response, accused me of being something based on the strength of a "useless assumption" made entirely by you. Furthermore, you have changed your position subtly while I have remained consistent. I remember now.
Short hand to this is... where did all the gentleman go? Same place all the gentlewomen went, naturally.
Its utterly ridiculous to lay all the blame on us.. lmao.
A
female
reader, QuirkLady + ♥, writes (6 June 2009):
 SyferFire,I favor relationships based on mutual respect. I don't expect my man to bend over backwards for me, and he doesn't expect me to fall over gushing with love because he held a door open. But, you know, keep on going with those useless assumptions there.
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A
male
reader, throese + ♥, writes (4 June 2009):
 To happymeg: "To Asian Tealeaf: Sorry, Dear, but most men do NOT want to be gentlemen. In fact, none of them do. What they want is for you to think that they are gentlemen. Why is this? Is it science? Dr. Gray (Men Are From Mars) says that this symbolic place of origin dictates that they can't help it. Mr. Crossfield (itsayshere.com) tells us that men are designed to mate with every woman in sight and can't help it. There is always someone (and we know who) looking for an excuse, and the more learned sounding the more reliable, evidently.Really, it is science. Men lack some sort of gene that regulates honesty and devotion and all the other things that we would like to take for granted but cannot. don't waste your time on fantasies."The Above is all of what "happymeg" said. Below I shall post my responses to her post."Sorry, Dear, but most men do NOT want to be gentlemen. In fact, none of them do. What they want is for you to think that they are gentlemen. Why is this? Is it science? Dr. Gray (Men Are From Mars) says that this symbolic place of origin dictates that they can't help it."That is not entirely true. Just from that paragraph, you say state as if it is a proven fact that gentlemen are basically just fictional people these days, because supposedly you can only find them in fictional novels/stories/short stories or even a figment of someone's imagination. Whether you believe it or not, miss "happymeg", gentlemen DO still exist in today's society."Mr. Crossfield (itsayshere.com) tells us that men are designed to mate with every woman in sight and can't help it. There is always someone (and we know who) looking for an excuse, and the more learned sounding the more reliable, evidently."Now, no offense to you, but that is utterly ridiculous and a load of lies. Why? Because I feel that that is saying that all men want these days is to have sex with every woman on sight. To me, it seems that you are comparing men to animals during mating season. Now, I'm not saying that is a fact, but that is how I perceive that part of your post. Not everyone will perceive it that way."Really, it is science. Men lack some sort of gene that regulates honesty and devotion and all the other things that we would like to take for granted but cannot. don't waste your time on fantasies."Now, in my honest opinion, this is where I get really annoyed. You say that "Men lack some sort of gene that..." and yes, you do go on to explain as to what that "missing gene" does/is supposed to do.Simply put, I believe that you are generalizing that all men were only put on this earth to mate with every woman they see and they were put on this earth for nothing more than that. Sure, that might be true that men and women were put on this earth to mate and have children to carry on for us, but that is not entirely true. I believe that humans were put on this earth to do more than just mate and then die. I believe that we were put on this earth to learn a lot of things, whether they are religious teachings, scientific, and so on, it does not matter.My simply belief and opinion is that we were put on this earth to live our lives to the fullest extent possible because we only have one chance in our lives to do what we feel is right or to do what we want to do. Whether it be for moral purposes, religious purposes, family, friends, relationships and so on, but maybe I am over analyzing this post of yours, if so, I do apologize.To the original poster:"What i want to know is this - do gentlemen still exist in the modern world - or are todays men not tough thow to be polite and courteous to women anymore??"Gentlemen do still exist in today's modern world, its just that its harder to find them these days because (I'm not generalizing) quite a few men these days (most that I have met and some of my friends too) can be quite mean to women. Why, I do not know the answer to that question.However, I still treat women with respect (as I have said in other posts) and I treat people in general the way that I would like to be treated."I would like to hear from both men and women on this? Anyone name some examples of encounters with gentlemen??"Um, one of my friends held the door open for me when I was in a hurry to get downstairs to my Art class the other day.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (3 June 2009): I 100% agree with Syferfire here.
I would like to consider myself a gentlemen, but unfortunately I have been met with a lot of double standards from many women I ecounter, and even scorn from some women at work, when I politely step aside and let them up or down some stairs first, you just get a sarcastic smirk.
Not all women react this way, I am sure there are many selfless, caring and respectable women out there who deserve a gentlemen. The trouble is, many gentlemen who have been put down and hurt by women, turn into jerks because it is simply an easier way to survive. These women will claim they want a gentlement, but will think of them as nothing more than a doormat to be used.
Another thing that I have noticed, many of these malicious women think that because they have a vagina, they are entitled to respect and to be put on a pedastall, news flash, sexual organs and gender do not entitle you to anything more than other human beings. These women want equal rights, yet expect to be "looked after" and given admiration from males,pick one option and stick with it!
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A
male
reader, SyferFire +, writes (1 June 2009):
This isn't just about doors. That's just the surface..I agree that a lot of men (and women) are jaded, and I agree that this developing society is largely at fault. Blending of gender roles.. deteriorating of family values. You name it.
"SyferFire,
Thanks for displaying exactly the kind of behavior I was talking about.
You can't make someone love you by doing things for them. You do them because you're nice or because you care about them and you DON'T EXPECT ANYTHING BACK. If do you get something back, it's lovely. If you expect to be loved because you bend over backwards, prepare to be used."
QuirkLady, In a good relationship, the care is mutual. I don't know what kind of a situation you favor, it seems like having the guy pour all his care into you unconditionally while you reserve the right to act indifferent/uncaring perhaps, but most of us are all just out there, looking for the good relationship.
I'm not the savior JC.. If you want such selflessness from a man, if that is what you TRULY want, then what about you? Are you as selfless as your standards demand?
I'd bet...the house... that you aren't. So why this inconsistent expectation? Why do you expect more out of a man than you expect from yourself? Equal rights, right?
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A
female
reader, Knight_in_White_Satin +, writes (30 May 2009):
 Closest I've come to the typical gentleman is my boyfriendxx.He does everything from holding doors open to kissing me on the hand when paying me a compliment. Though he says a lot of guys don't do that sort of thing because of extreme feminist who jump down peoples throats because they open the door for them.:S
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (28 May 2009): "Gentlemen" have been constantly sh*t on and had their hearts broken by too many women. Ladies, you're the ones who killed it. I can tell you the reason why I'm not chivalrous anymore, it's because women do not want a nice guy. Women get bored with nice guys, they're too safe, too predicable. Then they leave them. Well, some men actually have feelings, believe it or not, and it hurts. We are jaded.
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A
female
reader, QuirkLady + ♥, writes (28 May 2009):
SyferFire,
Thanks for displaying exactly the kind of behavior I was talking about.
You can't make someone love you by doing things for them. You do them because you're nice or because you care about them and you DON'T EXPECT ANYTHING BACK. If do you get something back, it's lovely. If you expect to be loved because you bend over backwards, prepare to be used.
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A
female
reader, 25sweetnsingle +, writes (27 May 2009):
25sweetnsingle is verified as being by the original poster of the questionI think a lot of the problem lies with todays cult society!!
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A
female
reader, happymeg +, writes (26 May 2009):
To Asian Tealeaf: Sorry, Dear, but most men do NOT want to be gentlemen. In fact, none of them do. What they want is for you to think that they are gentlemen. Why is this? Is it science? Dr. Gray (Men Are From Mars) says that this symbolic place of origin dictates that they can't help it. Mr. Crossfield (itsayshere.com) tells us that men are designed to mate with every woman in sight and can't help it. There is always someone (and we know who) looking for an excuse, and the more learned sounding the more reliable, evidently.
Really, it is science. Men lack some sort of gene that regulates honesty and devotion and all the other things that we would like to take for granted but cannot. don't waste your time on fantasies.
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A
male
reader, SyferFire +, writes (25 May 2009):
"You know, the "Nice Guys", the insecure guys who put you on a pedestal right away, can't understand why you don't like being smothered with attention 24/7, and think they are entitled to your love because they act like a doormat for you. A gentleman is kind because he feels it's the right thing to do, not because he can get something out of it."
LOL. Quirk
This is EXACTLY what I'm talking about. Where does this magic line occur between the two in your brain? You act like you know, but you don't. Its all freakin' whim. Are you familiar with Shakespeare at all? Romeo was the consummate gentleman with the antiquated poetic speech and all, he literally showered Juliet with "attention 24/7", and very much so put her on a pedestal. A balcony in fact. This is the type of guy the OP is talking about.
So what weird pseudo hybrid convoluted pipe dream fantasy man are you talking about, that he doesn't even fit the mold of this imaginary gentleman? God forbid someone that actually cares about you, through some unexplained paradox of the universe DARES to want to be cared about BACK. Sacrilege!
*roll eyes* I mean, sure, I hold doors, and help old ladies across the street, but as for the rest, naaaaahhh. I'ma get mine. Women like you are too vastly inconsistent with what you supposedly want, so I'll just worry mostly about me. Thanks.
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A
female
reader, TalkingHelps +, writes (25 May 2009):
 Of course it does! Opening doors, picnics on the grass, letters :) , surprise trips away
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (25 May 2009): my hb is a gentleman, when i met him he was young, rough but as years passed he settle down into the amazing man that he is. he opens doors for me (sometimes i am in a hurry and cannot wait for him to get to my side), he helps me with my chair when we go to restuarants, he is the big protector of myself and the kids, he is a gentleman. sometimes he washes my car, tells me not to worry he will buy the milk and bread, he even fulls fuel at his own expense sometimes. don't get me wrong, he has his bad side, wants his own ways esp when it comes to his "toys", the cars, guns, fishing stuff. on his bad days he is just as ungentlemanly as they come, esp in bed. then he is an animal. i received a sms from a distant relative a few weeks ago. we were at a family wedding and this lady wrote that she was so proud that my hubby puts his family first, she also commented that my boy was growing just like his dad, a gentle gentleman. i felt so proud that hubby's good manners were evident and made me realise not all women are blessed to have a man like this. so to all the men, we welcome more gentlemen in our lives. we can be feminine and somewhat feminists but i believe we can not go wrong with a gentleman. i love men that display these qualities.
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A
female
reader, QuirkLady + ♥, writes (25 May 2009):
Gentlemen do exist. I know quite a few guys who are polite and courteous and their girlfriends/wives appreciate it very much. I've dated a few myself, loved it and appreciated it. I think a big part of the decline is that fathers aren't around as much to show their sons how it's done.
Of course there are also a lot of people who think that being gentlemanly means you owe them something besides a thank you. You know, the "Nice Guys", the insecure guys who put you on a pedestal right away, can't understand why you don't like being smothered with attention 24/7, and think they are entitled to your love because they act like a doormat for you. A gentleman is kind because he feels it's the right thing to do, not because he can get something out of it. Women can tell the difference.
Ugh, sorry, went on a little tangent there.
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A
male
reader, heartfullalove  + ♥, writes (25 May 2009):
 Gentlemen do still exist, and if you prefer gentlemen, that's fantastic - go and find one!
If they seem to be outnumbered these days by guys who seem nasty, that's for the very good reason that most 'gentlemen' find it gets them absolutely nowhere with women, a majority of whom seem to have decided that men who are well-mannered, genuinely friendly, not sexually pushy, and perfectly courteous, are basically committing sins against masculinity. Hence, the heartless jerks seem to get all the sex, and some 'gentlemen' then let themselves be forced into changing their approach.
The good news is, some men are determined to continue being nice. They then run the risk of being written off by women as 'not man enough', or are seen as sexually disinterested, so women tend to have to pursue THEM rather than the other way round, because their basic good manners prevent them from going after women in the sexually forward manner they're accustomed to from the jerks.
So there's hope, but you'll probably need to do at least your fair share of the chasing. The sort of man who will ACTIVELY PURSUE a woman in the manner depicted in those 18th-century novels is, indeed, all but extinct. Those novels may entertain you, but they're a million miles removed from modern reality, and probably bore little if any resemblance to reality even then.
Good luck!
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A
female
reader, asian tealeaf  +, writes (25 May 2009):
 women are the ones to blame mostly for the lack of chivalry in todays world, or our society. feminism, has attacked men for years, with women moaning and groaning about their "rights" and that their just as able bodied as men. so men backed off and said ok, heres ur "rights". so a lot of men dont hold doors for women with groceries, or women with kids in arms. and the men are seen as rude. i have seen women get upset because men have held doors while they fumbled with their overload in grocery bags, mumbling about how they can do it themselves! then when they REALLY are in need they ask men for help, like at work places, where women will say they are equal to men, and can do just as much as they can-er, except during that time of month. then a thousand excuses come flying out of their mouths like why cant the men be understanding and compassionate? uh, u cant have it both ways. its like riding a horse and yanking on the reins in both directions. the horse gets confused and rears because it does not understand why u want left and right at the same time. so in all, when u find nice men out there who are genuinely chivalrous, its best to put ur best foot forward and be chivalrous back ans thank his generosity. i went to the bar once where a guy asked if he could buy me a drink. i said very nicely, no, thx, and he said to me, oh, ur one of those eh? i asked what he meant? and he called me a bitch. i was very insulted because there was no reason for him to reply to me like that. but i understood what he meant by that. and while i could not really hold it against him, personally, i do blame a lot of women out there who make nice girls like myself appear like bitches. and there are in fact a lot of men out there confused. and a lot of nice men out there turn bad ass because they figure women really want mean men. i for one have NEVER ever been anything but putty in a gentlemens hands. im neither feminist nor anti-feminist. i do what seems right for me and the situations i find myself in. i treat everything on an individual basis. for my, an asshole is what they are. but nice men are always welcome in my world. because i return the niceties and am always courteous and respectful to good men out there. i found treating men the way i want to be treated always fared me well. i open doors for men even though im aware they are more then capable of holding their own door. its just the fact that when i see a man carrying a kid, or a few bags of groceries, why not? i like it when someone helps me out. whether its a girl or guy doing it. gender has no place in my world whatsoever. only manners. thats my view.
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A
male
reader, damluvaam + ♥, writes (25 May 2009):
 Very good point SyferFire....It's very true that happens A LOT. Women can sometimes give you the "gas face" and act like they think you're weak and dorky if you're nice ...Very good point.
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A
male
reader, throese + ♥, writes (25 May 2009):
I am gentlemen and do not see the need to hide it. I'm proud of the way my parents raised me. I feel that women deserve respect, whether I receive respect or not, just because of the way I am, I do my best to treat them with respect and chivalry, even if I don't get a simple thank you for holding open the door for someone.
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male
reader, SyferFire +, writes (25 May 2009):
Problem is most women of my generation treat nice guys like complete contemptible pathetic pieces of dirt. You are basically describing a nice guy, what with chivalry and all that, no?
Case in point: I used to be a perfect gentleman, just as my mother raised me to be. Yes, I was, until my first..oh... 4 relationships or so did that in like a karate chop to an egg.
Now that I am a more jaded, less accommodating and more selfish, I am more successful with females. Go figure.
So I would say, you are taking the easy way out blaming guys for not being chivalrous anymore, when you should be levying some of [if not most of] the blame at women for not even rewarding chivalry anymore.
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male
reader, damluvaam + ♥, writes (24 May 2009):
To be perfectly honest, I believe most men really WANT to treat women with esteem and good manners (the greater populous jackass factor considered!) but they just dont know, all the time, how it will be received by you. Courtesy should be extended to anyone, male or female, but I wholeheartedly agree with you! That high regard, not condescending as though she cant open the door on her own, but respect and deference that I enjoy showing the finer sex is often missing and I think we can blame both men and women for the lack of it. I don’t care, really, if, in a social situation, a woman gets offended by my upbringing of treating women the way I do. I'm not doing it to offend and I’ve never had any of them say they were offended. Quite the opposite, actually. They seem to appreciate it a great deal.
Denny
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