A
female
age
51-59,
BigSis
writes:After reading several of the replies submitted by Agony Uncles here on Dear Cupid, I have come to realise, or should I say, believe, that the majority of them are really very sympathetic, kind, loving, caring ~ but most of all understanding.But why can't all men be like that? *she says snarling and showing her teeth*Why is it that some men have to behave like Neanderthals?I've suffered in the hands of some of those cavemen, I always seemed to attract that type of bloke. More fool me. I can't help it if I'm too nice.Is it that I was too accommodating at the start of my relationships? Spoilt them rotten? Smothered them with too much kindness? Showed them too much affection? Wanting to please them too much?Well, Lo and Behold!! Good morning BigSis!! I've finally woken up!! These guys saw my willingness to provide ... they used it for their own selfish benefit! They had it too good from the start, they got used to it and wanted more. They saw me as some pathetic weakling ~ then they took advantage.I know ~ and it's clearly too obvious now ~ that I am too wonderful to settle for man who cannot and will not give me what I need to feel loved and cherished. So, a word of advice girls, start as you mean to go on, don't let them take the 'p' out of you. You too are clearly too wonderful to settle for a man who cannot and will not give you what you need to feel loved and cherished. Someday, our wonderfulness will make someone very happy, who will, in turn, make us very happy.Take care girls.BigSisxXx Reply to this Article |
You can add your comments or thoughts to this article A
reader, anonymous, writes (31 July 2008): Hum...yeah I just think its being naturally deluded to those kind of things some of the time. I don't think its the persons fault at all most of the time.
By the way when did we start talking about trying to shape men I got lost?!
A
female
reader, Ask oldersister  +, writes (31 July 2008):
 Gecko, I agree and I wasn't being sarcastic about anything I said. I'm not a big proponent of psychology and much more of a pragmatist (what works and what doesn't). I look at "what is" and not "why"- I let 'why' go once it identifies the problem because it does nothing to solve it. Why people don't look at warning signs, I dunno except it must all have to do with denial, not because warning signs are absent all together. Like a football game, once it's over, you reflect back on why things were done the way they were to be better prepared next time.
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reader, anonymous, writes (31 July 2008): I think warning signs are there but due to people being so involved with their own problems, just with everything else, they're not in the straight mind to see the answers clearly.
For example, someone might be so infatuated with a guy, that they won't realize that hes using them.
If you get me.
This is becoming one hell of a debate...keep it friendly people and don't go overly personal.
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female
reader, Ask oldersister +, writes (31 July 2008):
Collaroy, if you didn't trust in the the belief that behavior was predictable, you wouldn't give the great advice you do on this site. What you said undermines what you actually contribute to these posters, quite accurately, I must admit. Take care.
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reader, Ask oldersister +, writes (31 July 2008):
Interesting, the only time Psychology was mentioned was in the last couple of posts and might I add your comment about it proved your point exactly. I'll just throw out an actual term from psychology and it's called "projection". Since I know nothing about psychology, I'll leave it to others to determine whether or not it's relevant.
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female
reader, heatherrrrrrr +, writes (31 July 2008):
 Collaroy, "Pyschology!" That's a new one. I thought they had spell checker built into most browsers by now. One thing that is fairly predictable - people who talk down about psychology generally have little idea what it entails. Or even how to spell psychology.Bigsis, you're getting caught in the "nice girl" trap. In the beginning of a relationship, you give as much as you receive. It's okay, nay, HEALTHY, to hold back just a little until you see what kind of man you're truly dating. It's later(after many dates paid for by him) that you pull out the big guns like cooking meals for a man and feigning interest in his work life. ;)Let the man do a little giving first. If it never happens, well then you know what he's going to be like for the remainder of the relationship.
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reader, Collaroy  + ♥, writes (31 July 2008):
 Hi everyone!!!
well I think anyone who thinks they can accurately predict human behaviour is at best kidding themselves , at worst delusional.
Seriously, the greatest thinkers and intellects throughout history have attempted and failed to predict human behaviour,I guess they should have all come on to DC and meet some of the Aunts who have apparently nailed it!
Give me a break guys, you can pick certain human traits but amateur pyschology really don't cut it in the real world.
I challenge anybody to figure me out: but here's a couple of clues for our budding Pyschologists: I am originally from New Zealand and I love little woolly sheep.
blaaahhh blaaah...
keep fighting Big Sis, you still got a big fan downunder ( even if he is a freaky Kiwi sheep shagger )
:)
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reader, Ask oldersister +, writes (27 July 2008):
My friend just cut bait on a guy she was dating for a month. She went to Vegas last weekend with her parents and brothers. The first night she got there, the guy texted her but she left the phone in the room to recharge and went to dinner and the casinos with her family. When she got back to her room, he had called her no less than 10x over a period of 5 hours. Although my friend knows she is a very special and wonderful person, she did not feel that from this guy, she felt alarmed. She called him back and way angry and he explained that he was "worried" that she may be mad at him. Hmmm...It's only been a month and this guy can't really have much emotional investment in the relationship yet and he's doing this?
Fast forward 6 months (more emotional investment) if she decided to fall for that: Say they get in a heated argument and she has to leave because of other commitments like work and they will have to resolve this later. Is this guy going to:
A). Calmly decide that there is nothing he can do about the situation and focus on his work and give her the space to sort things out and have confidence she will call him later?
B). Decide to cool off and reflect back on the argument and realize his overreaction and apologize to her later?
C) Call every 5 min and if she doesn't respond, show up at her work and demand her attention, maybe even cause a scene?
The answer is obvious and had she not looked at the warning signs and pretended that his actions were anything other than troubling, controlling, overreactive and disturbing...this is the situation she'd be in. Why do people choose not to see this for what it is? "He must be so into me that he can't live without me for even a day! This is love, look at all the attention he is paying me." "He was worried that maybe I was with someone else or something happened to me and that means he really cares". No, that's just thinking you are the unique exception to the most predictable pattern of events.
A guy that is a heavy gambler. What is the most likely outcome?
A) He will have 529 plans for his children, invest in risk adverse government insured CD's, stock away an extra few hundred per month in a separate account to retire early? Purchase long term care insurance since he thinks he may not be able to rely on social security?
B) Make sound financial decisions for his business and hire an accountant to balance the books and shop around for low interest business loans because he treats money with integrity?
C) Maybe lose his business because he's betting on a big payoff and watch his whole future go down the tubes?
This one is obvious too. When C happens, is he going to go home, read the newspaper while he sips on a cup of tea and discuss home improvements and offer to cook dinner?
"well, I just lost everything, anyone up for a game of scrabble or other types of quality interraction that will bring us closer as a family?"
I'm not being sarcastic, but human behavior is just this predictable.
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reader, Ask oldersister +, writes (27 July 2008):
Lazy Guy, I agree with you and people are predictable. We make thousands of predictions every day about people when we commute to work or in a shopping mall. For instance, we can predict when a car in front of us is going to turn into our lane before they put on the blinker. Human survival depends on us being able to assess so many situations without even consciously being aware of it.
We are in fact, experts at human behavior and to say that there are no warning signs is to just ignore what you see.
You are not dumb and you are not too untrusting. You just accept what you see, what is healthier than that?
Does it matter why people behave the way they do? From an objective stance, it's an interesting study but from a subjective stance (when you are in a relationship with that person), reasons behind the behavior often become 'excuses' for the behavior and staying in the relationship, in other words- DENIAL. To say there are no warning signs and that people are any less than predictable is to say that you are not responsible and you are much more comfortable being the victim.
It's like when you see that news and some husband has killed his wife and the neighbors say "He was always so nice, a family man, who could ever believe he would do that?" Well, the guy had 2 charges of domestic violence that were dropped and the couple was heard arguing late at night on a frequent basis and had been kicked out of the house a few times over the last couple of years. Really, who would have thought that such a nice man would turn like that?!
The thing is, no amount of logic can get these women to leave abusive situations and that's why this logic doesn't get through to them. I believe fear is a big part of what keeps these people in abusive situations and fear and lack of energy (repeated abuse) keeps them where they are. BUT...staying is still a choice and they must own that choice and I don't think BigSis is. It's one thing to keep yourself in an abusive situation, it's another to choose to involve your children in one. One would think that mothering instinct to protect your babies would be stronger and more important than your fears. It may be acceptable for you to be abused, but when is it ever acceptable to give them permission to expose your kids to this?
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reader, LazyGuy  + ♥, writes (27 July 2008):
 Perhaps I am just to much of a guy to understand. I like to think there is some sense in the world. That there is logic. If I do X and Y then Z happens.
As an outsider is just seems so often to be the case that the warning signs are clear. For instance a few years ago a guy I worked with was a classic case. Nothing was ever his fault, hatred of ethnic groups for no reason other then to blame them, temper flares but a real suckup to anyone he needed anything from. Divorced not seeing his kid. Of cours he had a young girlfriend, still in university while he was 39.
Didn't know her, but there were plenty of warning signs for her as well. Overbearing parents, bit of an outcast because of severe diabetes, clingy and a dreamer.
I don't think he beat her, just used her money to keep funding his business ventures, all failing, went on a trip payed by her parents right when several contracts were at crunch point. Just obvious that he was a loser. As an outsider I could see the warning signs and at once wanted to warn everyone (people employed by him besides his gf) to steer clear but at the same time realizing that they couldn't see past the nice facade he put up with people he thought he needed for now.
Part of the reason I read this site is to try to get some understanding why people behave like this. Am I just to paranoid, too untrusting or are other just to well... dumb?
What I am missing so far is a reason. Perhaps there simply isn't any, but that doesn't sit well with my image of the world. If there were no warning signs then aren't all men at risk from becoming like this?
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reader, BigSis + ♥, writes (27 July 2008):
BigSis is verified as being by the original poster of the question Well, I didn't know what I was walking into when this happened, otherwise I wouldn't have walked into it and gotten so involved. This happened well after I fell for him. To be perfectly honest Lazyguy, there were no warning signs. I think I was old enough to at least understand that much.
Quote"
"What makes your situation so unique from all the other abused wives?"
Did I say that?
On the contrary...
My previous quote:
"How many women are out there who are desperate to get out of a violent marriage, but are too frightened? Loads."
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reader, LazyGuy + ♥, writes (27 July 2008):
http://www.dearcupid.org/question/is-it-possible-to-make-yourself-like-someone.html
This story is hardly unusual for this site, people (men just don't post as much) just don't seem to be able to see straight when they are in heat. Oops sorry, love.
The above post is rather obvious, the girl is falling for the guy that is wrong and not falling for the nice guy. It happens and at least this one is bright enough to figure out the bad guy is bad (although not before she slept with him) BUT not smart enough to see the only possibly solution.
No, you can't make yourself love someone, so let the nice guy go BUT also DUMP the bad boy because he is a BAD boy. Stay single and see if you find someone who is both good for you and sets you on fire.
IF your ex took out his frustrations for what happened with his business on you then that was most likely always part of his personality. I am just an amateur with no education but let me take a wild stab, was he in his business dealings always quick to take credit for success and shift blame for failures?
My problem is that I always been an outsider, the stranger looking in. It is a 'hobby' of mine to watch other people, see how they behave. People in my experience really ain't all that complex, once they pass their twenties they are more or less stable barring major changes in their life. And with major I mean things like near death experience, disability, disease. Sure as we grow old we tend to mellow out as we accept that we are all mortal but the assholes remain assholes, the nice guys remain nice and I remained the same lazy bastard I was when I was twenty.
The way I read your post is that you went into a relationship with a guy who most likely exhibited warning signs that you ignored, either because you believed they didn't matter or were to young to notice. Then things changed slowly and the facade fell away and you got to see his true nature and for reasons for your own you stuck with it.
As dramatic as it may be to you, it is hardly a unique story. When so many women are in the exact same situation is there any reason to presume you were the only women who did not have warning signs? What makes you situation so unique from all the other abused wives?
Anyway, it is to late for you, you fell into trap, got out, good job BUT the real problem is getting other people to avoid the trap at all. And to that, you and women like you, need to be HONEST with yourself HOW you fell into this trap so you can warn others about it.
So forget my attempts at analsysis, do it yourself, you were there, you know what happened. Now what would YOU tell yourself all those years ago to stop yourself from walking into this?
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reader, q1605 +, writes (27 July 2008):
 I can tell you that both of my wifes were like total strangers to me by the time the marriage was over. And not in ways that would be noticed by outsiders. But behind closed doors they were as evil as anything I've ever seen. And in the beginning they were as kind and gentle as you could ask for. I have to go on their indictment of me as the reason. I can't see what part I played but, well one person calls you a horse you can ignore it, two? still ignore it but when a third calls you one I guess I should saddle up.
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reader, BigSis + ♥, writes (27 July 2008):
BigSis is verified as being by the original poster of the question
Quote:
"....but the guy you were with gave several indications that he had some problems and we either deny what we see (because we want to believe this is true love) or we accept the behavior we see and get out. By staying, you must have had hope that he would change and this is what LazyGuy was trying to point out."
Do you think I fell for him when he had problems? They came after. The reason I stayed was because I was frightened to get out. He became violent, and then the threats came. Unless some one's actually been in that kind of a relationship, they think it's easy to 'just get up and go'. How many women are out there who are desperate to get out of a violent marriage, but are to frightened? Loads.
Quote:
"I don't think a person goes from being perfect to a monster unless they have a brain tumor. I know the signs are there from the beginning...."
He did and they weren't.
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reader, q1605 +, writes (26 July 2008):
I have one word for you ... Prosthetics
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female
reader, Tisha-1 + ♥, writes (25 July 2008):
 Sorry BigSis for highjacking your article.
Q, aren't your one two dangling from the rearview mirror of an ex's Chevrolet?
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reader, q1605 +, writes (25 July 2008):
older sister is right about our expectations and lazy guys point. Women can't help but fall into the trap of viewing marriage as a fairy tale because that is the way it has been presented to them since about day one. Your typical man sees a date with a firing squad. After the wedding the guy finds he was selling it all short and that marriage can be quite likable. Because he had no expectations save bad ones.When the womans expectations are never met they can become disillusioned. This doesn't take into account the individual nut bag each of us might find ourselves hooked up with. THe nut bag factor skews things way out but in general this is a pretty close to real life way that your average marriage plays out
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reader, Ask oldersister +, writes (25 July 2008):
"Some women go into a relationship thinking love conquers all"- BigSis, I do think Lazy Guy has a point and I don't get the impression he was laying all the blame on you but I do think you have this mentality. LazyGuy can certainly correct me if I'm wrong, but the guy you were with gave several indications that he had some problems and we either deny what we see (because we want to believe this is true love) or we accept the behavior we see and get out. By staying, you must have had hope that he would change and this is what LazyGuy was trying to point out.
Women grow up watching movies and reading romance novels that reflect very unhealthy relationships that end with happily ever after. In my experience, love doesn't work like that. A guy with a gambling problem that files for bankruptcy 2x has problems you can't fix.
I really believe we choose our experiences and if we have repeated ones, we have to look at ourselves and change our approach. I don't think a person goes from being perfect to a monster unless they have a brain tumor. I know the signs are there from the beginning and I think you need to follow your head first, as unromantic as that sounds, and then let your heart follow.
Now Q1605 and Tisha....
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reader, q1605 +, writes (25 July 2008):
tisha double what? is this a reference to peaches? Double is two correct? How do I love thee? Let me count the ways. one two one two one two
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reader, BigSis + ♥, writes (25 July 2008):
BigSis is verified as being by the original poster of the questionNo LazyGuy, I didn't try to change him, he changed himself. Nothing and no one could 'fix him'. I was the same person ~ from when he met me ~ to when he started to turn nasty.
Pressures from work, financial stuff, etc. must have been the cause of his personality change. Who knows? He was bankrupt, twice, I might add, which made him take everything out on me and my children, the closest people to him.
He suddenly went from this kind caring loving guy with whom I fell hook line and sinker for.... to a controlling nasty piece of work who began to physically, mentally and on several occasions, sexually abuse me. I even had 2 miscarriages because of him. I've never gotten over it. In a way, I suppose it's a blessing, as I would have had 2 kids by that animal.
I fell in love with him because he spoilt me rotten and made me feel secure and loved, I had no doubts, not because I was 'in heat', as you put it, it's not all about sex.
I honestly thought that our relationship was going to be as perfect as my parents'. That's all I ever wanted.
How was I to know he was a Jekyll and Hyde?
The other thing he didn't like was that because there was an age gap, he was feeling extremely insecure, we were suffering terrible financial problems, {plus he was a heavy gambler} 'MY' house was on the line... so I had to go out and work. I was offered the job of a lifetime and earned bloody good money working for my cousin who was the Chairman of a football club.
The place had an adjoining banqueting suite and disco, I was front of house receptionist and more or less ran the place, but he was more worried about me being surrounded by the 'younger than him' guys, and constantly accused me of having affairs.
Well, after 13 years, I managed to break free from him, it wasn't easy, but in that time I suffered the loss of 'MY' house and much much more.
Soft touch...that was me, all over.
I'm 150% certain there are women out there who have experienced similar if not the same.
What more can I say to you, LazyGuy? I'm not looking at the world through rose~tinted spectacles and I certainly am not expecting the fairy tale ending, because those are extremely rare nowadays.
I've ranted enough now, just to prove my point, so if you want to carp on about how it was my entirely my fault why I got invloved with such a person, then it's up to you.
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reader, LazyGuy + ♥, writes (25 July 2008):
Some women go into a relationship thinking love conquers all. I got a pet theory that while men know they have feelings of lust and of love and that there is no relation between them, women think that the moment their panties catch on fire think they are experiencing true love.
What else can explain women staying with a guy who is basically good because he only beats them once a week?
As they grow up, women like BigSis start to realize that just being in love, or more accurate in heat, isn't enough. Guys don't change except that once they got you, they drop the act and show their true colors. Anyone with a brain could spot these true colors but... well lets ask BigSis and all those women who agree with her.
What made you go for these guys that without fail didn't give what you desired?
I think it is simply that young women are raised with fairly tales where true love wins through no matter what.
If you were used by a guy, be honest, did you think you could change him? That your love would fix him?
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reader, Tisha-1 + ♥, writes (24 July 2008):
Ah, the Steve Miller Band. Great song. But mind the double entendres, they can trip you up!!!
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reader, q1605 +, writes (24 July 2008):
Peaches
we really love your peaches
gonna shake your tree
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female
reader, BigSis + ♥, writes (24 July 2008):
BigSis is verified as being by the original poster of the questionI believe us women are like apples on trees.
The best ones are at the top of the tree. Most men don't want to reach for the good ones because they are afraid of falling and getting hurt. Instead, they sometimes take the the apples from the ground that aren't so good, but easy.
The apples at the top think there is something wrong with them, when in reality, they're amazing. They just have to wait for the right man to come along ... the one who is brave enough to climb all the way to the top of the tree.
xXx
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reader, caveman  +, writes (15 July 2008):
Me Tarzan you Jane. You know you can't resist.
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reader, iateadonut  +, writes (13 July 2008):
Sometimes I'll deliberately ignore someone who wants my attention; it's because you don't know whose real - my thoughts wander back to being a kid and having a girl flirt with me just to bolster her self-esteem.So, you might get a lot of the sensitive guys, who are very vulnerable, who really feel - they put up defenses so they don't get hurt.On the opposite end, you have the guys who feel nothing, no innate decency - every social interaction is just protocol and rules; they have to put up the opposite front so that people won't see what buttholes they are.... by the way, there was a comment (by Yos) on pickup books talking about finding vulnerable women. Where did you find this kind of book? Are those books published in the Netherlands like that? That kind of ruins my image of that country... Every pickup book I've read is all about improving yourself and making your personal goals the center of your life to make yourself more attractive, and then developing social skills because the good women are usually in crowds and have healthy relationships.
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reader, anonymous, writes (13 July 2008): I disagree with Phsyciatrist-to-be (by the way I think your name is spelt wrong). There is no way in hell that the whole proportion of men are as sensitive as women. There might be a small percentage, but there are a small percentage of women that are totally insensitive and things go straight over their heads.
Women tend to understand things more. Thats not our fault, its not your fault and its not their fault. Its human instinct and all animals have it including the Gecko. The men scurry off (hehe) and the women stay and have to remember where all their children are.
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reader, q1605 +, writes (12 July 2008):
My approach is tried and true. Maybe its time to get my eyes checked. The ability to accurately gauge the distance between my "date" and her gardening tools is extremely important
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reader, Ask oldersister +, writes (12 July 2008):
Q1605, I think it's time to tailor your approach when it comes to women- startling them with your exposed person while they are gardening is not prudent. How about some light conversation over coffee?
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reader, q1605 +, writes (12 July 2008):
a woman lunging at your package with hedge clippers tends to focus the mind
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reader, Phsyciatrist-to-be +, writes (11 July 2008):
 Men are just as sensative to things as women: we just tend to be very proud too, and smother any "mushy" feelings in macho behaviour. Not all of them, of course. But I think I'm speaking for the majority.
But then, if we didn't act all tough etc, we wouldn't be men, lol.
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reader, anonymous, writes (8 July 2008): Haha q1605 where do you get your inspiration from...
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reader, BigSis + ♥, writes (8 July 2008):
BigSis is verified as being by the original poster of the questionOUCH!!!
: ^ o
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reader, q1605 +, writes (8 July 2008):
big sis. don't weep for my danglers
for those appendages still dangle today
But instead of them dangling
where the good lord had meant em
they hang from the mirror
of my wifes chevrolet.
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reader, anonymous, writes (8 July 2008): Haha ermm I like to think so ;)
Are you flirting with me?! - shame on you =P
Ahh can you cook pie?! Pie is very good =]
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reader, BigSis + ♥, writes (8 July 2008):
BigSis is verified as being by the original poster of the questionWhy Gecko, thank you for that. Are you one of those fish?
: )
{just kidding}
Oh and I'm a great cook by the way!
BigSis
xXx
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reader, anonymous, writes (8 July 2008): We're sorry....Ahh but men are designed to be insensitive, reckless and arrogant. We can't multi-task, we can't think with our brain.But we are better at multi-choice questions than you women - so we can choose!The main reason I think you find very sensitive (thank you), smart (thank you), and mature people (stop it!) people on here is because they have been through similar pain and understand what your going through. I don't understand though why men treat some of the people I have spoken to on here the way they do?!My excuse is that this is a small minority and a lot of women do live very happy lives. There are still some good fish in the sea! Don't give up BigSis!By the way, I personally think with my stomach.
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reader, BigSis + ♥, writes (7 July 2008):
BigSis is verified as being by the original poster of the questionThank you for that Tisha..{Blesha!!}
Being the ever optimist that I am, I know I'll find the right bloke......one day.
ps. The tan's still looking good, I'm keeping it topped up, naturally mind.
Sis xXx
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