A
male
age
36-40,
anonymous
writes:Hello aunts,My question here is simple. I fought with my wife last night. The reason was that she started complaining and saying she wishes she didn't have to pay rent (we pay half-and-half currently) so that then she could buy more things. Basically she complained that our financial situation is not what she would like. This is a recurrent problem in our marriage. We are not poor in any way shape or form. I work for a multinational company and make in excess of $100K per year. She makes more than $60K. We live in a place where living costs are high, but nonetheless, I still believe we are blessed and financially comfortable (at least relatively).However, she wishes she could buy $5,000 purses whenever she feels like it and she gets upset that she cannot. When she starts thinking about this, she refuses to hug me or hold my hand or even talk. She regrets (and has admitted as much quite a few times, including last night) that she cannot be "spoiled" by her husband like other women like her. I try to be as understanding as possible (I even bought a computer for her like a month ago because she said she wanted to learn programming), but, apart from pointing out that we just don't have the money to live how she would like, I dislike being measured as a husband based on how much money and gifts I "shower" (or not "shower') her in. I think I am a good husband in many aspects, I try to please her, I don't cheat on her, I offer emotional support whenever I can and I concede most of the time when we have disagreements. But I think it would be disrespecting myself to accept having to "buy" my wife's love or respect.So yesterday, when she was again expressing her feeling, I tried to hold her hand and hug her. I was even about to tell her that I was working towards a better future in which she would have more money for her needs. She very rudely pushed my hand away. I know that arguing over THAT never gives good results, so I stopped speaking to her for the rest of the night. When I went to sleep she started saying "so you just give up on me?". I told her I was just giving her the space she has requested in the past. Then we started quarreling.Here is the important thing. At some point I said that we had a fundamental disagreement over what being a good husband means. Then she said, in a very low voice "great, then I guess I'll find someone else". I was utterly furious and let her know as much. I did not insult her but I did raise my voice and let her know that if she dares say anything of the sort again, I will consider us done (and I mean it).After that, she said that she didn't really mean it and it was either a mistake or a "quarreling strategy" (the story changed a couple of times throughout the discussion). However, her attitude was dignified, as if she had been the wronged party and were trying to just end the discussion honorably. I told her such "quarreling strategies" were completely unacceptable and that she would not accept the "explanations" she was giving if I had been the one who said that. I think she would have slapped me or something.In the end we agreed to forget it. Later (like at 3 AM), I woke up with an anxiety attach because of all the tension, I told her "baby, I'm scared" and tried to hold her hand. She again pushed it away very rudely and said she wanted to sleep. This morning she got up and cooked lunch for me to take to work (like she does every day) but I was (and am) still upset. She did not try to reconcile and her attitude was not welcoming or loving. After cooking she said "I would like to sleep now, I packed your lunch over there". I said "thank you" as amicably as I could and I left for work.My dilemma is this. Usually I am the one who takes the first step to make up after a fight like this (she is too proud to even say "sorry" most of the time). But this time I"m determined to wait until she does it. I'm not planning to play hard-to-reconcile-with or anything. As soon as she approaches wanting to be in good terms again, I'll accept. If she had not said that she would "find someone else" I would do it regardless. However, I think I should stand firm this time, because I need her to understand that "finding someone else" is not an acceptable quarreling strategy or even mistake. I want her to really think twice before saying something like that, because I plan to follow through with my warning if she does. I think I have a marriage worth fighting for, but it will be disrespecting myself to accept such "threats". What do you think? Should I still be the one who (again) initiates the reconciliation? Or should I stand firm?
View related questions:
money Reply to this Question
Share |
Fancy yourself as an agony aunt? Add your answer to this question! A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (2 October 2017): Step your foot down. If she wants $5k purses she can find another sucker. You married a gold-digger and need an exit plan. She explicitly told she's ready to branch swing. What exactly don't you understand?
A
female
reader, YouWish +, writes (29 September 2017):
 It's NOT about the purse! Any guy who has married a woman knows that oftentimes, it's not about what's being discussed on the surface. The way this guy runs the money in the household is wrong and unfair and unequal.
I'm not saying this as some gilted housewife. I'm actually the primary earner in my family. It would be just as wrong for me to withhold my income away from my spouse who makes less and works just as hard for the home and family. He has equal stake in Family Household, Inc.
Just to set the record straight -- money isn't even the most valuable resource in a marriage. The most valuable resource is TIME. If there are kids, the time spent there, and in keeping the house, cooking, errands, everything.
If all of you Aunts and Uncles out there who are clamoring for him to leave her sit back and think, SHE would be the better off in this. The courts would immediately rectify the inequality by granting spousal support, and she's already making $60K. Then the division of the assets, and if he's got a 401(k), pensions, mutual funds, retirement owed, and other stocks and bonds as well as shares in businesses and so forth, then half of that would be given to her...MORE if she has children. Their house, their vehicles would be split 50/50, which would decimate him as the primary earner.
She isn't in this to get handbags. She could get all the $5000 purses she wants if she left him, went to move into a more reasonably-priced place to live, and kept her income plus about 1/3 of his until she remarries. She doesn't WANT that. She wants equality. And in a marriage, it shouldn't matter who earns the most. It should be equal because there's EQUAL TIME put into the marriage, the family, and the household.
...............................
A
male
reader, Billy Bathgate +, writes (29 September 2017):
If you have no children, Leave. This woman does not respect you and I doubt that she loves you so leave. There is no reason for you to have put up with this type of emotional abuse and manipulation.
If you stick around prepare yourself for a lifetime of the same abuse.
Have no doubt women and some men here are going to make you out to be the bad guy you're not. You're the victim of an emotionally manipulative woman. A woman who has told you numerous times you're not up to her standards as a husband. You can choose to remain the victim or not it's up to you.
...............................
A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (29 September 2017): Absolutely gross that anyone could argue over not having a $5,000 purse!
There is no humanity in your lives at all.
You are so far removed from others that you will never see how disgusting it is.
Little kids going hungry.
Sickness over dirty water.
Children sleeping on the streets and thats the absurd value you put on human life.
Give $5000 to a needy charity for needy kids and tell her to go sling her hook elsewhere.
...............................
A
female
reader, YouWish +, writes (29 September 2017):
Yeah, what she's resisting in you isn't the desire to buy $5,000 handbags. It's that YOU are using and leveraging power by keeping your money separate. You have one household you expect her to give equal effort in keeping by cooking for you and cleaning and making you lunches, but you're not reimbursing her for her time she's spending on you. Not only that, but come on. You pay for evenings out and trips, all of which are infrequent variable expenses, yet she's paying 50/50 for rent on a place that's been scaled to YOUR income, not hers.
You're married, meaning all assets are community assets. Both of your incomes, your possessions, your pensions, your savings, your holdings, your investments are all 50/50. There is no longer "yours and hers". And if she's threatening divorce, if I were you, I'd knock it off with the threats, because she'll have you over a barrel and your nuts in a sling with alimony and asset splitting with the way you've set up.
Here's how it SHOULD work:
Yours and her income should all be FAMILY income. The bills come out of that family income, including an EQUAL spending allowance for both of you. Deposits into a savings account should be treated like a bill to be paid from the general fund, but STOP with the "mine and hers", because if you're married, it's "ours" legally.
If saving money is a priority, then you both combine incomes, decide on a monthly allowance to spend in the budget, and if you want to open your own accounts to put the allowance in, then so be it. Otherwise, decide TOGETHER on the amount to save to short and long-term savings, liquid and investments. That way, it's equal. If, say, you each get $500 per month to spend without any accountability, she can save for those purses, and you can rest easy knowing that savings are taken care of.
I mean, come on. What the hell would it matter to her if you're working toward a better life? She can't see past her own income, and she's got way too much of the expenses she's carrying. What someone else said was correct. If you make excess of $100k and she $60k, and the house you live in was bought with the $100K budget in mind, you're burying her in unfair expenses to go 50/50. If I were her, I wouldn't be threatening divorce to you. I'd be starting proceedings if you didn't listen, and I HATE $5,000 purses!
You should be paying 66% of the rent and utils just to make it fair, if you can't let go of the security blanket of controlling your own expenses. What you're doing is dead wrong to her. You own what she owns, and she owns what you own. That is marriage.
You're used to a single-income family? Your father would have gotten strung up by your mom if he treated money like you do. Having a joint bank account doesn't mean that she gets the cookie jar and can spend like a mad bandit. It just means that you and she are equal partners regardless of who makes what, and you've been making her unequal, and THAT is what she has the problem with, not stupid purses.
...............................
A
female
reader, Dionee'  +, writes (29 September 2017):
 I see that both of you are very hard headed but I can understand both sides of the argument.
From her side, she's saying that you aren't spontaneous enough in your spending and this in turn makes sure that she isn't allowed to splurge on certain things. I get you when you say that she cannot just want to buy such expensive things all the time but what about once in a while? A lot of women like to be spoiled in that way. It's not as if to say that she wants you to be her personal ATM. It's just that she wants to be be showered with gifts now and again as if to say "I appreciate you". I mean, most women would not wake up to COOK lunch for her husband. That is something that she does out of love as I can imagine she does with other things. It would be nice if you could also do things for her out of love. This is her perspective.
Look, it is kind of whiney of her to put down the financial situation because the two of you are better off than most but maybe allowing her some extra money to play around with wouldn't be so bad.
You must remember, she is looking at the quality of life that she so deserves compared to the one that she's actually living and it seems like she's put a price on what she deserves.
As previously mentioned, traditionally (and biblically), men were always expected to fend for their families and bring home the pay check. Women were always expected to care for the household and kids. Now, perhaps somewhere in her mind she has realized that a part of her actually agrees with these traditional views. Maybe she just wants to be able to say "My husband has a job and takes care of me financially" which is what most women these days would like to have the chance to say.
Now, as for her acting cold towards you, it's unacceptable. If she cannot even be affectionate to her own husband when he is clearly trying then she has a bit of an attitude problem. Regardless, she should've been there for you through your attack and offered some comfort no matter what the two of you are going through. If she cannot put aside her attitude when you most need her then she needs a serious talking to about that.
This isn't a competition of whoever apologizes first loses... come on... It's your marriage we're talking about. If you care enough for her then you will put your feelings aside and reach out. Hugging her isn't the same as saying you know what, I'm sorry. Hugging her isn't the same as wanting to try. If I were you I would just put my childishness aside and squash this argument.
Both you and her need to understand that you aren't little kids who are allowed to throw your toys out of the cot, you're grown adults who need to stop their crap and start acting as such.
...............................
A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (29 September 2017): Hello,
I'm the person who wrote the original message. This is in response to the female reader. While most of what I'm going to write may seem "defensive" I want to start by saying that your answer really gave me a different perspective no our financial arrangement and was very helpful in making me think of ways to avoid these things in the future.
It's not 50-50 of expenses. It is rent and groceries only. I pay entirely for meals out and trips. That being said, I had no idea that is how it is set up in other marriages (my dad used to be the sole provider so I never had such arrangement in my house). It surely gave me something to think about. If that really is the case I will probably modify the arrangement.
I used to give in the past, just nothing too expensive. Flowers every week, small but good gifts here and there, etc. And of course, sometimes I would give her things like the computer. She always was rather dismissive of those things because she thought I was disrespecting her for giving her "cheap" stuff (those flowers were at least $70 every time) so at some point I decided to stop.
Also, I have told her that she could decide to leave work forever tomorrow and I would be willing to bear the entire burden myself. I mean it. Also, I have always told her that she can consider herself free of the need of saving for retirement. I am willing to take that burden completely upon myself, whether she keeps working or not.
We do not have kids and (most importantly) we are not planning to have any. Ever. Also, with all due respect to her, our jobs pay different salaries for a reason. I work 16 hour days sometimes and I sometimes have no weekends or holidays. Her work allows her to stay home basically whenever she wants and her bosses basically ignore she exists for the most part, so she is able to nap every single afternoon. Why she has not been fired is beyond me, I think she is very fortunate.
I don't mean to sound arrogant or egomaniac but I am very romantic. It's just in my own way. I used to write songs for her. I wrote a poem once. Like I said, I brought flowers and I like to hug her and kiss her a lot. I always try to offer my emotional support. She is not very appreciative of this because she says that all of that has no practical use. I'm not sure I buy that, because neither does jewelry or expensive bags. It's the price tag that matters, apparently. If I'm ever actually stingy with money I guess it is because I despise that mindset.
But now is the time to discuss the most important stuff. I completely reject the notion that a loving partner (man or woman) is ever justified in threatening to find someone else. Even if it is not serious or even if it's in an emotional moment. I feel angry at her very often and I often have to resist the urge of saying something hurtful. You know what? I always do. Each and every time. Why? Because I respect her and love her. Women (or men, for that matter) have no right to play the "don't take me for granted" game. Because if she is not to be taken for granted, neither am I. If she is a desirable woman, I am a desirable man and have my options too. So let's treat each other as equals.
I'm not going to question whether or not you are right in saying that women expect men to reassure them after saying something like that, but I find that mindset completely insane. It is terribly disrespectful to tell a guy that you'll find another one. So does that mean that the girl is with you just because she has nothing better? Are you a placeholder or something? And after being insulted in that kind of way are we expected to just back off and reward the one trying to hurt us? Not happening. Not with me at least. Again, if I had been the one saying that I would have gotten slapped in the face at the very least. So let's be equals here.
The breakfast detail was nice, but it's the attitude that I did not like. She did not look like someone trying to make up after a fight. She looked like someone trying to grandstand and prove that she is the "mature one".
Also, did she reassure me that she didn't mean it seriously? Or did she actually mean it seriously and she's trying to take it back because she's not ready to divorce right now? No way to know, right?
In sum, if she really is saying "if you wanna keep me love me harder" there's two major problems: (1) I reject the notion that price tags are an acceptable measure o love and (2) it goes both ways.
In sum, you have really given me a new perspective and I will certainly rethink our financial arrangements. Surely they can be improved in her favor. But if that's really the problem, she should bring it up in calm discussion. She has no right to threaten to find someone else (whether seriously or not) to make her point. I'd shoot myself before doing such thing, no matter how angry I am. She is an adult and I certainly expect her to be responsible for her temper. Or at the very least apologize explicitly, something that she has not sincerely done.
...............................
A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (29 September 2017): Okay, I think a few things are going on here. Your wife is not dealing with things in the most mature of fashions, but in fact I suspect that you are both hot headed. I am going to try to offer some insight into the situation, the female psyche and also what I think might be some underlying issues behind her comments. First of all, you said yourself you pay 50/50 expenses, however your salary is quite a bit higher than hers. This is not the usual set up for a married couple. Usually each partner contributes the same PERCENTAGE of his/her salary to expenses (e.g. each pay 30% of their salary on mortgage expenses, lets say). Therefore she would be paying less money than you (but still the same contribution from her salary). So I think she resents your set up and probably feels that you are being overly stingy with this arrangement. Reading between the lines and because of this arrangement, I think you might be quite tight-fisted with money in general. I think she is exasperated feeling your stinginess and that many things in your lives together probably feels like a "business deal" where you are probably demanding almost 50/50 contributions for many things, rather than demonstrating generosity and spirit of giving. Like it or not, culturally more often than not the man is the main "provider", that is how we have been conditioned for centuries, and arguably there is even biological evidence for males being the "providers" (e.g. in animals bringing gifts and making the nests) while the females give in other ways and have the work of giving birth! Now I am not saying that your wife shouldn't contribute her fair share to the household- but what I am saying is don't get caught up in your stinginess of her having to pay 50% of everything. You make more, so be willing to be generous and give more freely to her. Often men who are head over heels in love give willingly and happily in many ways (as much as their salary allows). I think your wife sees your stinginess as reflecting/symbolizing a love that is lacking or limited somehow. What she wants to feel is that you would be willing to splurge on her from time to time, without thinking of the cost to your personal bank account. That you would do something that is just for HER, a big gift symbolizing how much you value her. For example, many women like to receive jewelry every few years, because it is NOT practical, it is symbolic, pricey, and doesn't have anything in it for the man. Giving expensive jewelry is like saying "I love you so much I would give you your heart's desire with no benefit (and great cost) to me". Same with the purse that she mentioned. What I would advise is show her you are willing to splurge now and then (a nice big Christmas gift). However, obviously her expectations have to be toned down and you can't splurge all the time. Show her in smaller ways like buying flowers now and then for no reason that you care. "At some point I said that we had a fundamental disagreement over what being a good husband means."You don't say what you both said during this discussion but I suspect you both got pretty snarky. She told you she "would just find someone else then". I think it is clear that she was NOT being serious at this point, but that she was in a temper. By telling you that she WOULD or COULD find someone else, she is essentially telling you "LOOK, I am a DESIRABLE woman that could have ANYONE I wanted, DO NOT TAKE ME FOR-GRANTED" Not the most mature way of expressing it, but often something like this slips out from a woman's mouth when they feel underappreciated. Usually they are looking for the man to reassure them and say something like "Don't be crazy, I would never let another man take you away from me, no one could ever love you as much as I could. Would you really want someone else?" and she would say "no, of course not" and then you two would make love lol! So- it is an immature strategy to get your ATTENTION and let you know that she is DESIRABLE, SEXY and wants some PASSION back in your relationship! She wants you to romance her and woo her with some thoughtful presents.She needs to learn a bit from your realism and tone down her expectations, while you need to learn to be a bit more romantic and splurge on her now and then. Finally- she made you breakfast!!! And she does this EVERY. SINGLE. DAY. when she has her own job to worry about too! No wonder she feels a little underappreciated! THere is more than one way of smoothing things over after a fight. If she still got up to make your breakfast she is making an overture. I think there is no shame in you also making overtures to her and apologizing, discussing how you both need to compromise in a rational way.Never get tired of initiating reconciliation! It is essential to do over and over again for a strong marriage, never be afraid to say you are sorry! It is not weak but strong! Finally, I think it is ridiculous that you would leave her if she said something like "Guess I'll find someone else". Really?!?! You would leave her for something so obviously said sarcastically in the context of a fight? Something that obviously means nothing? I don't think you are being rational here. You said your vows to this woman. She reassured you that she didn't mean it seriously. Things you both don't mean are going to slip out from time to time. You will have to move on from that. See the translation of saying "I could find someone else" is "if you wanna keep me, love me harder"
...............................
A
male
reader, Fatherly Advice + ♥, writes (28 September 2017):
 Exactly what will you gain by waiting her out?
You think about that. I have some suggestions, but when it comes down to a woman who wants to spend 5k on a purse, I just don't have any experience.
I'd like to suggest that you do some serious reading. One book I have read is His needs, Her needs. One I haven't read is Hold on to your NUTs. Take a look and see what you think will help.There is a lot out there.
Essentially she is testing you. and right now you are passing.
...............................
|
