A
male
age
30-35,
anonymous
writes:I recently found out that my wife is having inappropriate conversations with someone who she had a crush on several years ago. I know for a fact that she asked this person a hypothetical question saying "Let me ask you something, what if I say hell with everything and want to come be with you for 2 months?" To this, this so called "friend" said anytime, just let me know when.But then she said something like "I know it will never happen" in a resigned manner. I feel quite devastated to know about this. And yes, I know for a fact that this happened as I have proof provided by someone. I think I should leave her as this is as good as cheating. But I thought we had 2 good years together. I still care for her emotional well being but I don't see myself being happy with her. She has a lot of baggage and is a emotionally fragile person which is why I am thinking twice about even confronting her, let alone leave her. But I feel I won't be happy with her and it will be just a show if I continued to live with her.Please let me know what you think. Should I move on?
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Fancy yourself as an agony aunt? Add your answer to this question! A
female
reader, Guardian wings +, writes (3 March 2017):
You are welcome :) Yes, coming from a similar socio-cultural background brings an immediate relatability and understanding of the situation and person. Thanks for the wishes. I wish you a happy life ahead too.
A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (1 March 2017): @guardian wings
Your insights have been amazing and have helped me see the light. The fact that you seem to be from India makes your advice just that much more relative and a little personal.
Once again. Thank you for your help! Wishing you the best in life.
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A
female
reader, Guardian wings +, writes (28 February 2017):
That was me who answered earlier as anonymous. The website did not allow me to post again and I had to register.
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female
reader, Guardian wings +, writes (28 February 2017):
Well, one's shallowness reflects everywhere. In relationships, choices, IQ, EQ etc. She may not be a big time gas lighter or anything. As you said, she may be compatible with someone who has their interests aligned along similar areas. Needless to say, they can play mind games back and forth, cheat on each other and watch shows like big boss or comedy nights. He will laugh at wife jokes and she will read the tabloids with utmost seriousness. Their kids will get handfuls of their silly jabs and lies. Hey, they're genetically coded to handle it though. And that's how my friend, one of them was perpetuated into the next generation. Let's just hope even people like her find people like herself and let it go. Good luck to you, now that you got through this, you've learned something valuable. You don't have to judge people with a past, remember even you have 'baggage' now. Pack up only what you really need for your journey. Don't carry the unwanted stuff. But you know the dynamics of a relationship and know what kind of people to avoid now. That's the sad thing the traditional society's setup does not provide space for. They thought by forcing one gender to stay within 4 walls (ensuring her side of the loyalty) and sacrifice no matter how the man is (ensuring no consequences of his disloyalty) things will work out. They totally left out the need for compatibility as our society looks down upon trial and error in the pretext of 'purity', which is what in my view sucks. Imagine had you been given the opportunity to know a woman well before marriage, you'd have never got tangled in this mess. Although I get it was an arranged marriage, you guys should have known each others respective pasts (not in every detail) but in brief. It is basic even if you are dating a person, and marriage is BIG. It's great to not THINK much or dwell in the past. However you can't ignore it altogether. Why does one have to present a CV in an interview? Your education and activities are all in the past. Similarly. Obviously you would share your past with someone whom you'll meet next to marry right? Why didn't she do the same? It's not about the sex or virginity But I hope she had shared with you about being in relationships? You said you were taken aback so that indicates she did not share at all! It's like walking through the door and then knocking it.Prayers for you, TC.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (28 February 2017): @Anonymous - About hobbies, you are again bang on. She hardly has any hobbies. She watches a lot of celebrity interviews and often breaks when watching films. It has got to a point where I have a handkerchief out during some scenes in movies because I know it is going to pull some strings about her baggage, making her cry. I have been supportive that way but her watching celebrity videos really irritates me.
I have told her that those people will say anything on camera and may not always be lying but that we shouldn't be taking life lessons from them. But she gets annoyed when I advice her against this. So, I just let her be.
She occasionally tries reading or swimming but it never works out consistently.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (28 February 2017): @Anonymous - You continue to puzzle me with your wisdom about my situation. First of all, I am glad that you got over your boyfriend and moved on. You sound like a very positive person.
As for replies to your questions.
I wouldn't say all the time but she has advised me a lot about how I must think and not be closed off (in her opinion of course). She has always called me judgmental even though I have just thought of myself as a black or white person.
But yes, physically she is very picky about my hair looking a certain way, me dressing a certain way. I wore sober looking shirts before I met her and in fact I met her wearing a sober looking shirt. She said I looked neat then but every time I wear that shirt, I always get asked to change as it is too dull. There have been many occasions where I have had to change. I wouldn't say it was all manipulative as she did open me up to a more colorful fashion sense but at the same time I do get what you are saying, especially when I look at it in retrospect now.
About me posting on agony aunt and her calling it break of trust if she found out, you are so bang on. When I initially found out about her past affairs after marriage, I was a little taken aback and shared those thoughts with my brother. She found out that I told my brother about her past and her exact words were "You have broken my trust". I told her I just needed someone to talk to but she would not have any of it.
Your last statement is so true. Out of the few people I have shared this with, the ones against snooping are those who seemed to have two-timed or at least done something questionable. I think their guilt makes it impossible for them to advice or support snooping.
I think I will be ending this soon. I will get her parents involved and make sure she has someone looking over her when I deliver the final blow. I am still a bit worried about how she will handle all this but I don't think I have the level of tolerance to put up with her personality anymore. In fact, I honestly think she will be better off with that crush of hers. I don't know how long it will last though as that guy is already going through a second divorce. Maybe they will be made for each other. God knows.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (27 February 2017): Coming to jokes,It's alright to joke around with friends of opposite sex. But definitely not with your ex, or someone who likes you. The context is important in a joke. A private message conversation with such joking around is very different from a group of friends joking on pairing people up for fun or a group of friends with mixed genders cracking adult jokes. It is SO different from privately talking stuff to a person of opp gender. Also, when a person is MARRIED, personalized jokes and talks totally cross the line irrespective of the context and situation! To add, it is also cheap type of fun that shows a lack of intelligence and productive things to do. People who have better pursuits do not indulge in such lame, cheap jokes/talks for 'fun'..talking to exs and meeting pretentious people. Instead their idea of fun would be something with better class and sophistication. How about a hobby or reading a book? Does she have any hobby apart from playing mind games?
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (27 February 2017): I'm so sorry for you man. I've been there and know how it is when a cheating partner flips it on you. You take the blame, and you'll keep taking it. She'll keep doing this to you, making a fool out of you and over time, she'll make it seem like you are the crazy insecure, unstable psycho creep who is stalking on her social media. You don't wake up now, trust me, you will end up believing that's who you are. All she will do is conveniently cheat more and also enjoy your suffering and pain, trust me that is giving a greater ego boost than anything else. She's not only a manizer( like womanizer) she's also a player ie. one who gets the kick out of playing mind games with people. Every time she has a victim she's secretly winning in her own game that she's secretly playing alone. This could be anyone, even a friend. She could play with you, her siblings, children, parents..just about anyone can be the victim. Watch and observe her pattern of behavior with others and you'll be able to see it outside of your colored glasses one fine day. (I say this because when you love someone, you are looking at them through colored glasses). In fair play, there are no lies and cheating but for these people it's important that they win regardless of whether they've cheated or lied. In their view, others are fools and it's the duty of others to remain as fools. If you stop being a fool, it's going to anger and annoy her as it will make her the loser. There are the same types of humans in both genders. This just proves it. And being someone who went through the same thing and successfully got out of it, I can tell you life is amazing once you are done and over with that kind of a person. Don't drag this. I regret dragging it for years, but I was just a dumb teenager. Thanks to my parents who rightly identified his character as they had seen me cry and be moody through many years and I gave me the strength to quit the guy right before he tried to marry me for money and as a scape goat for his abnormal ego games. Such people will have you addicted to them more than you would be to a normal person. They'll get you obsessed to the point where your life HAS to revolve around them no matter how independent you are because deep down, you know that they aren't capable of love and it's your task to make them love you. You got this, I'm sure you're old enough and mature enough to handle the separation. There's a whole life ahead of you. Please don't do the mistake of making a family with such a human. It's as good as throwing your future away into trash.Just out of curiosity, does she criticize you all the time in the pretext of 'helping' you? Like pass negative remarks on your physical attributes, thinking patterns etc. Advice you on how to be a better person maybe? or that you should change your friends, your dressing style etc. Talking about how great some other guys are? I just get the feel that she MIGHT also be a gaslighter. Don't freak out I'm asking this, plain curiosity.Btw. Disregard the obligatory apologies she's giving you and get the hell outa the unhealthy relationship. It is common knowledge that flirting is neither a joke nor excusable in a relationship let alone MARRIAGE. Belittling you is part of the gaslighting I mentioned earlier. That is the reason I wanted to know. You wait and see, if she finds out you posted things on an agony aunt column, she'll act like you are a big cheat and say she can't TRUST you. IMO snooping is not bad, on a partner who is evoking suspicion. How the heck else are you supposed to be sure the person is cheating or not? What options are we left with. Let us see-1. Be fooled all your life.2. Wait until the day you open the door to your spouse on the bed with someone else like in the 19th century.2. Break up with no surety if they cheated. (haa of course how can you commit the crime of seeing your spouse's phone. Wait you can walk in while they're in toilet, you can see them naked, you can hear them snore or fart but no way, you can't see their phone! breach of privacy OMG!!!) Lol. Screw the people who say you can't snoop, they may have been cheaters at some point in life and cannot relate to the peeves of honest ones.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (27 February 2017): @anonymous
You were so spot on! I told her that I knew about the conversations and she is just saying that they were joking around and she can't believe I took it seriously. But she keeps coming back to my insecurity and now is belittling me for snooping on her. She says she never cheated and that just talking and flirting wasn't cheating.
She did say sorry for talking like that but also keeps saying that she can't believe I am taking this so seriously. I told her I need some time away but I can't believe how she has flipped this on me, like how nothing has happened from her end! Quite stunning.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (26 February 2017): I wanted to add that, had she been innocent, she would not have shifted the blame on you. Albeit she may have got frustrated, agitated and angry, she'd have opened up her social media accounts to prove her innocence. Her manipulation and blame game shows that she has a lot to hide from you. She's the kind that even if you showed her the proof and all the conversations, she's act like there's nothing wrong in what she's done. She knows that your mind is not twisted like hers and will use that to mess with your head. She's not going to be shocked, believe me. She'll act like "Huh. What's wrong in that? I was just joking with him. YOU ARE INSECURE" again. the same game of hammering you down with the shame of "insecurity". Even if you catch her in the bed with someone, she'll say you are the insecure one for not being able to 'forgive her mistake'
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (26 February 2017): Hi OPShe's clearly manipulating the situation, making you look like the bad guy. Why does she have to put up an act saying, "You should have told me if you don't want me talking to them". Why do you have to tell her? Are you that dominating? Can she not figure for herself what's right and what is wrong? so if you don't "tell" her that she is not supposed to have sex with her ex, is it alright for her to do it now? Because you did not say so? It's one thing to bump into an ex and say a polite hi or talk briefly. Why does she have to deliberately make plans to meet them? A friend can become a lover but a lover cannot go back to being a friend. Ex's cannot be friends in the first place. It's no big deal to have a sexual past or relationships in India these days. Then why does she act like she has a huge baggage or a heart that's torn apart? She ought to have focused on building a healthy and happy marriage with you instead she's behaving like some rebellious teenager. Flirting with ex's meeting them up kissing them on the cheek LOL. How old is she? It surprises me that after having had a few relationships and overcoming them, she's this immature. It looks like she knows all the dynamics of relationships and is abusing her experience to gain power in your relationship. She's secretly getting a kick out of rubbing it in your face that she has all these ex's talking to her, evoking a retroactive jealousy you never had in the first place. You seem like a simple man with a healthy mindset. She's just trying to mess with your head. All the attention and your legitimate jealousy is giving her a rush. But what she expects is you to not voice it out and spoil the fun she's having. She wants you to continue being her source of rush. So every time you voice out she'll hammer you down with the shame of insecurity. Once you're hammered down she goes back to teasing you and getting the kick out of it. While on the other hand she's probably doing the same to her ex's by showing off that she's married now they can't have her fully but she can throw them a few bread crumbs. A lame old game of power play that got old in the teens! Do yourself a favoor by saving the evidence for the court hearings instead.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (26 February 2017): @AnonymousOP here.I did have a talk with her, just yesterday. I didn't tell her that I knew exact conversations but I told her that someone told me that she had said inappropriate things to the two men I had written about, in my first post. I was very vague about it, pretending that I knew very little, enough to be just a little worried.She was angered and blamed the situation on me. She told me that I was insecure and that I could have told her not to speak to these men if I wasn't OK with it. Well, I knew she spoke to these men before but only was OK with it because she had given me a confirmation that they were just "friends". I had specifically told her that I didn't want her speaking to people with whom she was in a relationship with, especially physically. She had just said they were friends and that the most she did was kiss someone on the cheek, to say goodbye, once. But I know she had a full blown sex life with one of the men, while she has messed around with the other guy. All this was before being married to me of course.I now know that she is lying and capable of lying. I find this quite disappointing. I still haven't told her that I have evidence. I think she is going to be very shocked and might even act aggressively or completely break down if I told her I have heard her conversations and also have proof of it.But this has left me in a very bad place. Let me know what you think but I think I might have to end this.
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A
male
reader, Peregrine_UK  +, writes (25 February 2017):
OP, your wife sounds like my fiancée. My advice to you is similar to the other replies here: trust your gut. If you know/feel deep down that she's not 100% committed... you know what to do. Good luck, either way.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (24 February 2017): Hey OP, Anonymous here again.
I would like to give a few suggestions before I start off.
A person's life could be about "ME" (when you are single) or "US" (when you are married) . It cannot be about "HER" and only "HER". When any individual places another individual as a higher priority than himself or herself, it is
1. Unhealthy
2. A disaster waiting to happen
&3. Foolish
These concepts of sacrifice may exist in movies, fairy tales or ideal philosophy but is extremely unhealthy for you and anyone involved.
Now, since you are married, this is about "US". You need to get that very clearly before proceeding to do/decide something. Ultimately, marriage is about the relationship, not about you, not about her. If the relationship is good; the two of you are happy. If it ain't good; both or one of you is unhappy. I really appreciate how you truly love her and are concerned about what will happen to her. That's pretty selfless of you. I'll tell you something mate, every person's behavior has a reason that can be traced back to it not being their fault. You can dig the life history of a murderer, a rapist, or a terrorist and conclude they had some experiences which led to them becoming a criminal. After all, every human is born a cute little innocent baby! The problem happens when these people become a threat to the sanity and well being of others.
So what will happen if you leave her and all men in future leave her? She will end up alone. OK. Do you think that her having a husband is the be all and end all of her being happy??! She isn't happy ANYWAY! She's not going to be happy alone but face it, she's not going to be happy in a relationship either.
Coming to your specific situation, I can definitely give my personal opinion on what you should do but unfortunately this ain't the right time.
At this point it is essential that you first confront her, sit down and have a talk with her. Some drama and arguments are inevitable. Still, it is important that you do this. Don't straight away accuse her of being a cheat, avoid using any disrespectful language out of anger. You would have to muster up some emotional intelligence when you get talking.
Remember, even if you choose to move on in future, you can do so only if there's closure. For a closure, it is most important that you have all the information you need to confirm to yourself that this person is not worth your love and that the two of you are incompatible in terms of morality and thoughts.
During the talk, first find out as much truth about the events as possible. (Don't believe anything unless there's proof). Allow her to calm down, sink it in and tell you what had been going on. Discuss what are the reasons she's been unhappy in the relationship. Now what according to her is staying faithful, you said she talks about being open minded etc. Try to understand whether both your boundaries wrt loyalty match. You don't have to give up your values for her. As long as your rules are equal(no discrimination based on gender), you have every right to get out of a relationship where her boundaries don't match yours. It's good for both of you. For eg, if she comes up with some statement like "I think healthy flirting is okay. You are just being jealous/possessive" and if you, on the other hand have never wanted to flirt with other women, then clearly there's a difference in your values and hers.
Cheating is complex. Only certain types can be worked through/forgiven. First you would have to conclude what type of cheating has been going on and what kind of a cheater she has been in your relationship. What I strongly suspect from her character description is that cheating is part of her personality rather than the relationship. No matter how great or romantic you are, it looks like she would be tempted by opportunities.
On the other hand, forgiving and working through can be considered in the case when the cheating happened due to some mistakes on your part, where in she was unhappy in the marriage because of ill treatment from your end and toying with the idea of leaving you for this someone else. Even this is based on two conditions- 1. She chooses you over the other person. 2. she feels sorry for the hurt she's caused you by betraying your trust and asks for forgiveness. If she were that unhappy in the marriage she could have very well initiated divorce before starting to chat up flirtatiously with other men. Are you so bad a man/husband that cheating was the only way out for her?
Please have a talk with her, open the can and see what crawls out. Let me know what's on her mind and how she's reacting to the whole thing and then I'll tell you whether you need to go your way or mend it to join hers.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (24 February 2017): I am the OP or the person who asked the question here.
@Anonymous who has written about my wife being someone who needs validation. I am amazed at how you have described her character! You are right. She has very low self esteem and also has a tendency to make everything about herself. She is a good person otherwise but she just can't seem to stop doing this to herself. If she was helpless, I would go to any length to work this marriage out. But the problem is that she becomes aggressively defensive when I bring anything up. She actually flips the blame on me, saying I need to be open minded and less judgmental.
Just out of curiosity, what do you think I should do. Should I move on? I know that will be the easy way for me but what stops me is what will happen to her. I am sure she will get over me in a couple of months, maybe less. But then, I think she is going to be eventually unhappy with every man she is with, simply because her need for validation is going to turn off all future prospects as well. It is such a predicament. On one hand, I want to be happy but on the other, I want her to be happy just as much.
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female
reader, anonymous, writes (23 February 2017): Hi thereBy your post and follow up, it seems like she's both selfish and immature. Looks like she derives pleasure from all the extra attention she gets, she likes to make you jealous by calling out her crush's name during intimacy (and don't think it was a slip of the tongue, it's purposeful. Your innocence and denial is stopping you from seeing that)Her approach towards relationships, marriage and men is based on one thing: validation. She's looking for validation, compliments and a boost to her esteem rather than love and sharing of happiness. An incomplete person who does not love himself/herself cannot love another person. Not even his/her own children. Such people are looking only for validation. Love or sex is not about you or the ex or any other man. It's always about her. The focus being: They love her, you love her. She does not love anybody. She's just busy trying really really really hard to convince herself that she's good enough to be loved. A classic and sad case. Even people who seek validation can be faithful if there's love and some sort of regard for other's feelings and if they aren't selfish by nature. But your wife seems to be a bad combination of insecure, low self worth and selfish all put together.
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A
male
reader, Billy Bathgate  +, writes (22 February 2017):
You've only been married two years and she is already looking for an out. Sit her down and discuss it with her but be calm. Hear her out then decide if you think the relationship is worth saving. If not you had two good years.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (22 February 2017): @Youcannotbeserious - I am the person who asked this question here at DearCupid. First, I have verified this conversation first hand. I did some snooping and am not proud of it but I know for a fact that it happened. There is no doubting that.Secondly, I did not know about her past. I was married through an arranged marriage. She presented herself as a strong, independent woman with a very positive outlook on life. But after marriage, her behavior is so influenced by baggage. It is very frustrating at times because she gives me a lot of compliments in front of her friends but then goes off in a zone where she says "it sucks to get attention from everyone else when your husband doesn't say anything". I do give her attention and compliment her now and then but most importantly, I care for her and have influenced her life in a positive way. She sleeps better now and I have told her how to deal with problematic friendships and even mend her ways with her parents. She chooses to ignore all that and focuses just on this romantic bit. I don't understand how she can say she loves me and then think about being with another man. I didn't say this initially but she also felt elated about receiving a love letter from her ex after we were married and she bragged about it to her friend. This is also verified information. I don't understand how someone who is married can accept a love letter from an ex, let alone be so elated about receiving one. She once used her crush's name while we were intimate as well. I pretended to not hear as I was too taken aback at the time. Can you now tell me what you think, now that I have given you more information.
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A
female
reader, Youcannotbeserious + ♥, writes (22 February 2017):
 If this is just gossip, then you need to be very careful because a third party's version of events may not necessarily be an accurate portrayal of what was said, and they have no way of knowing what was meant or how serious it was. Also they could have their own agenda, so be careful how much you believe.
Even if you have seen this in her messages (checking other people's private messages is never a good idea and, if you are insecure in any way, will inevitably unearth something you are not happy about), I would be taking it as a warning that your relationship needs strengthening. Your wife is not planning on leaving you (and your definition of cheating is definitely not the same as mine!) but fantasizing about being free. Given what you say about her having "baggage" and being emotionally fragile, this is probably all tied up with her past experiences. You presumably married her being fully aware of all this and, by the sound of it, you have had 2 happy years so far.
In your shoes I would be looking at ways to strengthen your relationship so that your wife does not feel the need to dream about being free. Do you compliment her? Bring her little gifts? Tell her you love her? Take her out to dinner? Tell her how lucky you feel being married to her? None of these things are big in themselves but will make a big difference to how she feels about your relationship.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (22 February 2017): Nobody married should be talking to another person about how it can be if they were together. What she did is crossing the line. It just isn't right. Move on. Be happy and true to yourself.
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