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My wife has decided all sense of affection between us is over as well as our sex life

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Question - (27 December 2011) 17 Answers - (Newest, 31 December 2011)
A male United States age 41-50, anonymous writes:

My wife has decided all sense of affection between us is over as well as our sex life. 8 years ago, after the birth of our 3rd child, she convinced me to have a vasectomy so we would not have any more children. Immediately afterwards, my wife's interest in sex evaporated. I think we might have had sex once this year.

Now, she cringes when I touch her hand, touch her shoulder, or put my arm around her. I do not remember the last time we kissed or when we last said, "I love you." Whenever I try to talk with her about this, I get one reason after another as to why things are this way and each reason is something we both agree I can do nothing about, leaving me feel as if I am being punished for things I cannot influence. I try all sorts of things to show her I still love her despite all of the daily grind life brings but she dismisses each and every attempt with belittling remarks. If the kids misbehave, it's 'my fault'. If the laundry is still not done because I was at work all day, it's 'my fault'. If I did not grow to be as tall as she would like me to be but am the same height as the day we married, it's 'my fault'.

She suggested counseling but, as soon as I agreed, she lost interest in the idea. She has also described her perfect guy and I can see from the description she gives I can never live up to that ideal; not even close. She has also said she would be more interested in affection and sex if they involved someone other than me. :-(

I am barely 35 and do not want to spend the rest of my life unaffectionate and celibate simply because she is deciding to take out life's stress on me. What do I do now?

P.S., I was advised not to ask this question on this site because, in the words of the advising person, "People will respond with greater animosity towards you and a stronger sense of 'Well, you just do not understand women,' just because you are a guy." I am confident, however, such will not be the case.

View related questions: at work, celibate, sex life

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A male reader, anonymous, writes (31 December 2011):

I am the anonymous poster who suggested you leave.

A decade ago I would have answered like you just did. I can identify strongly with you. In fact, I did not leave either. I am just strongly thinking it over. In fact, I am going to take the advice I am giving you below:

I really think you need to separate from her. You don't have to get a divorce just yet. Just spend some time apart focusing on yourself instead of on "the relationship." Ask her to do the same. Maybe she will agree to counseling in order to "get you back." I am not saying to leave as a threat, but to legitimately express what you have told us and which she is not listening to. Sometimes people get comfortable with a relationship and stop working on it. I am sure that there are things about you that drive her nuts, too, but how can you know when she won't share? You have to bring her back to the table.

Also, I hate to break it to you but... some marriages are shams. I am not saying yours is, but she is not contributing to the marriage and in that sense it is a sham. You are the party keeping it going right now. She is not doing her part. I'd call that a sham marriage.

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A male reader, Fatherly Advice United States + , writes (29 December 2011):

Fatherly Advice agony auntI'm glad to hear you are confident and that you are serious about keeping the wedding vows. I see that your eyes are open. That was my main concern. Yes get into counseling this is too much for you to bear.

FA

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A male reader, anonymous, writes (28 December 2011):

@The anonymous male reader wanting to have a conversation with his younger self: I see your point and it sounds really tempting. However, the "for better or worse" part (or maybe even the "in sickness and in health" part if she is depressed, as was suggested earlier) of our marriage vows have got to count for something; else the entire marriage could very well have been a sham from the start.

No, I will not leave her. I am merely looking for help in either 'untying' or 'cutting' this 'gordian knot' in our marriage.

Thank you for the advice just the same.

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A male reader, anonymous, writes (28 December 2011):

@ Fatherly Advice

1) Interesting, I will take it under consideration. However, having a "case" to compromise (and I am presuming you are referring to a "divorce case"; do correct me if I am wrong) is the least of my worries at this point.

2) I only mention the vasectomy due to the curious coincidence of timing with respect to her change in attitude. Plus, I do work out, have "a good hair cut", an have definite interest in sports (and not just a spectator interest). As far as laundry goes, I need to set an example of responsibility for the children to follow. So, that suggestion is probably not going to be followed; no offense.

3) I can say for certain she is not seeing anyone else. If she were, it would be all too easy for me to find out.

I do not feel "unmanned bu (sic) the operation". The only "demands" to which I am "giving in" have been getting the vasectomy (because it was much cheaper than having her stay on the pill and less risky than her having her tubes tied); not trying to force her into sex when she says, "No"; and agreeing to go to counseling. While I do other things she asks me to do, I do so out of a sense of teamwork and not because I feel such requests are "demands".

I can also say for certain she does not want "the manly / stud / caveman that gave her three children" because for the first few years of our relationship one characteristic of mine she said she really liked was the fact I was not the stereotypical "manly / stud / caveman" kind of guy but, instead, was just "me".

You may have a point about not wanting "a housekeeper / girl friend" except I think it is fair to say I do not well qualify for either role.

Knowing such a pattern has occurred with other relationships does take the worst of the sting off of this situation. Thank you.

Nonetheless, I have tried "manning up" in ways similar to those you suggested back before the kids were old enough to really notice what was happening and it did not work.

Thanks for the "Fatherly Advice", however.

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A male reader, Fatherly Advice United States + , writes (28 December 2011):

Fatherly Advice agony auntI know this is going to sound cold, but this is a real possibility and you should be told.

1)Prepare yourself financially, move the money out of joint accounts. Get your affairs in order. Don't do anything that could compromise your case.

2) Man up. Work out, get a good hair cut, play a sport. In short stop moping about your vasectomy and be the best manly man you can be. You might also want to stop doing laundry except your own.

3) Find out if there is an affair.

Now the reason for my advice. You felt unmanned bu the operation and in some ways it has made you so. You are giving in to her every demand and not standing up for your self. By doing this, with every good intention, you have in fact become less attractive to her. She wants the manly / stud / caveman that gave her three children. She doesn't want a housekeeper / girl friend. Because she has lost interest in you she may have found another interest. This is a real danger of the situation you are in now.

Sorry to be the one to say this. I also read a marriage / divorce message board and your relationship looks very familiar.

I could be completely wrong. There are women out there who think sex is only for making babies and they think the vasectomy signals their retirement. It's wrong thinking and it doesn't make for happy families. Either way manning up is the best thing you can do to get her attention. I know it seems backwards but it works.

FA

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A female reader, So_Very_Confused United States +, writes (28 December 2011):

So_Very_Confused agony auntDear OP... Happy Hannukah to you and yours too...

I see how much you love her and I am so sorry that it's hard for you.

I personally don't agree with Dr. Laura at all either... crock of poo in my opinion...

I think therapy for yourself is a grand idea... Associated Jewish Charaties offer low cost counseling in this area perhaps they do for your area as well???

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A male reader, anonymous, writes (28 December 2011):

@So_Very_Confused:

While you make an excellent point, my wife's response to the "But I go home with you" comment would be, "But, if you could, you'd prefer to go home with her."

As far as divorce goes, it would be my last choice to get one, if at all.

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A male reader, anonymous, writes (28 December 2011):

I am in your situation, except another decade down the road. My wife told me she was not interested in sex with me, but could be with another man. She blames me for everything wrong in her life even though I am one of the few things that went right. She won't kiss, won't cuddle, won't have sex. We don't even share a bed anymore. I have gained weight, but she has gained more (in pounds) and I am 9 inches taller. She suggested counseling and I agreed, but it has been 8 months now and she hasn't found a therapist/counselor. She expects me to do so.

Dude, I am thinking of leaving, and I suggest you think long and hard about it also. It's not easy to do. You don't want to leave your WIFE. She's your wife! On the other hand, is she really acting like a wife to you? My conclusion is: No. I want a wife. I hope and wish it was her, but she has other ideas. That's the reality.

She's a broken person and you can't fix her. She has to want to fix herself. Right now she doesn't want to. Leave her. Maybe it's what you both need. It's a harash reality and I cannot believe I am giving you that advice, but it is what my older self would tell my younger self. Get out before you waste another decade with this woman.

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A male reader, anonymous, writes (28 December 2011):

@Shygirl18: I had considered depression of some sort. However, since she is not exhibiting any sort of low mood, low self-esteem, or loss of interest or pleasure in other usually enjoyable activities, the definitive symptoms of clinical depression combined with the fact I have known her for over half of my life, giving me just enough sense of confidence to say I probably know her better than almost anyone, I would not put much metaphorical stock in that answer being the correct one. In fact, at this very moment, she is playing video games with the kids and seems to be having a grand time. No, the loss of interest seems to be solely directed at me. Thanks for the suggestion, though.

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A female reader, Shygirl18 Ireland +, writes (27 December 2011):

Just to save you searching:

postnatal depression: (this is taken from wikipedia)

Symptoms include sadness, fatigue, changes in sleeping and eating patterns, reduced libido, crying episodes, anxiety, and irritability. Although a number of risk factors have been identified, the causes of PPD are not well understood. Many women recover with a treatment consisting of a support group or counseling.

Sadness[7]

Hopelessness[7]

Low self-esteem[7]

Guilt[7]

A feeling of being overwhelmed

Sleep and eating disturbances[7]

Inability to be comforted[7]

Exhaustion[7]

Emptiness[7]

Anhedonia[7]

Social withdrawal[7]

Low or no energy[7]

Becoming easily frustrated[7]

Feeling inadequate in taking care of the baby[7]

Impaired speech and writing

Spells of anger towards others

Increased anxiety or panic attacks

Decreased sex drive – see Sex after pregnancy

- All symptoms. I just seen that this started 8 years ago after the birth of your 3rd child. I think it may have started as postnatal depression and then snowballed into clinical depression. Suggest this to her, maybe she'll take a better look at herself. Tell her the least she can do is take a deeper look at how she treats you, as you have been doing the same for her for a while now.

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A female reader, Shygirl18 Ireland +, writes (27 December 2011):

I don't know a lot about marriage, but I do know about women and depression.

How long ago did your wife have her 3rd child? Is this a dramatic change in her emotions for you or has it been gradual over the years? She could be suffering from post-natal depression. I suggest you research this on the internet and tell her you think she may be suffering from it. When stuck in depression it's really hard to listen to what people are telling you, though you 'hear' some noise coming from them.

WRITE DOWN the effect her words have on you. Be very blunt with her and tell her you're being blunt with her for a reason because you find she doesn't listen when you're polite. Tell her she's being extremely rude to you and treating you like you don't have needs as well as her. Tell her you shouldn't be treated like a second class citizen. Keep nagging her to go to therapy.

Tell her you love her and this marriage means more to you than any pride. Go to therapy yourself if you have to, set an example for her. Be very persistent. Buy those marriage books listed below.

What is key to keep in mind. DON'T get a divorce right away. Marriages are precious, and many have ended for better a reason than yours. You have to give it 110% before you let it get to that point, don't just sit back and watch the embers turn to ash, you need to reignite that flame. And think about your children! Children are very perceptive to failing marriages and it can cause trust issues later in their lives, though sometimes less damage can be done with a divorce. Point out to your wife that she is so negative.

I seriously think this is post-natal depression. It can last several years after child-birth, get her to a doctor.

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A male reader, anonymous, writes (27 December 2011):

@eddie85:

1) Yeah. No. We are both familiar with Laura Schlessinger's work. Without going into specifics, I can say unequivocally, Laura Schlessinger did not have an accurate model of our marriage in mind when she wrote those books. Maybe those books would work for someone else but certainly not us.

2) Provided I can find an affordable one, I will certainly consider this. Thanks. The original counseling proposal was to be thru her church, of which I am not a member, but I will see if I can still attend.

3) I have and still do. However, I am met with cynical remarks along the lines of, "What do you want?" and, after years of near constant repudiation, continuing to engage in such "two ways" gets old and tiresome real quick.

4) We actually just did this a few days ago. No such luck.

5) While I appreciate the compliment, I find communicating in person much more effective since I can add vocal inflections, gesticulations, and other techniques to reduce the risk of misunderstanding. At the same time, I have laid all of this out to her in prior conversations. Yet, I am still here.

Thanks for trying and happy Hanukkah.

@ The anonymous reader: As you can probably tell from my comment to eddie85, I have and you are right; this situation is not easy.

Regarding the advising person, a friend from long before I met my wife, in her words, "You would probably find the overwhelming number of people on these sites are women ... and we can be quite 'catty' at times." Note: her words; not mine.

@babu3u and bunnyblueeyes: I am still with her because I love her. I don't know why I do. I just know I do, even when she treats me this way. However, as mentioned earlier in this comment, I am sure you can see I have already talked with her about this to no avail.

Thanks to all.

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A female reader, So_Very_Confused United States +, writes (27 December 2011):

So_Very_Confused agony auntPersonally if you asked to go to therapy and she won’t go, I don’t see much hope for the relationship. You have to be able to communicate and talk and it sounds like she does not want to make any effort to make it work.

I just let a marriage that was acceptable (although not a red hot passion and not a perfect marriage) go for several reasons… ONE of which was he refused to go the counseling. I am now with a man who I plan to marry next year who asked ME to go to therapy with him to work on our relationship (mostly about communication).

While I can easily go weeks without sex I cannot go a single day without affection. I better get my cuddles and kisses at bedtime.

If my partner said to me that he would be more interested in affection and sex if it was with someone else instead of me, I’d be gladly giving them their chance to go find it… changing the locks, packing their bags… tossing them out…

As for her idea of perfection… I am far from my fiancé’s idea of perfection but as he said to me yesterday in the car after admiring a lovely young woman who is his ideal… first he made those lovely yummy yummy drool drool noises.. and then turned and looked at me and said “but I go home WITH YOU right???”… EXACTLY… look all you want baby, get your appetite somewhere else and come home and love on me…. RIGHT… got it. And trust me if I could fix his teeth or make him a bit taller or fix his hair trigger temper… I would… but I can’t so I accept him and love him where he is.

IF your wife is not happy… make her happy… give her a divorce and get a life and a partner that treats you properly.

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A male reader, eddie85 United States +, writes (27 December 2011):

eddie85 agony auntGee, your perception of this site is probably just the opposite of reality. From most posts similar to yours I've seen most people are very supportive of your situation.

First off, let me state that your problem is somewhat common. People in marriages lose interest in one another or lose sexual interest. Sometimes that is a result of physical issues (menopause / depression) or sometimes it is emotional.

Here are somethings that I recommend you do:

1) Buy the books The Proper Care and Feeding of Marriage (for both of you) and The Proper Care and Feeding of Husbands (for her). Both books are by Dr Laura Schlessinger are easy to read. I think both books are extremely powerful and having read them myself, I think you'd fine the stories / problems easily relateable.

2) Consider going to therapy yourself... even if your wife doesn't want to go. I think it will help you sort out what you are feeling. They may also be able to give you the tools you need to make changes in your life.

3) Remember, marriage is a two-way street. If you haven't said "I love you in years", you could change that today. Try to do one special thing each day for her... something out of the ordinary.

4) Consider going on vacation -- if finances allow it. Even if its just a few towns over. Staying in a hotel can always work wonders. Try to find a romantic place: Las Vegas, Paris, New York, Chicago -- whatever works for you. If this isn't cost effective, why not have a date night. Go bowling, see a movie, see a play... just do something without your children.

5) Finally, write your wife a letter. Keep it short and sweet. You obviously can write (well, I might add). Why not send her a love letter explaining the hurt and loneliness you feel. Tell your you love her and miss the intimacy that you once shared. Don't write a novel and don't make it accusatory -- explain your pain however and express your feelings.

Take things one day at a time and work to make sure that you are doing your share of making her "want" to have sex with you.

Merry Christmas and Have a Happy New Year.

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A reader, anonymous, writes (27 December 2011):

I would say try talking to your wife and telling her you want to work on your relationship in therapy because you simply can't live the rest of your lives like this. I am sorry to say that if she refuses to seek any help, you may have to make a decsion about whether to stay in the marriage or not. It's a hard situation to be in.

As for your advisor, I am not sure where they got their idea from, but most people on here are pretty caring people. Good Luck, I wish you the best.

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A female reader, babu3u United States +, writes (27 December 2011):

babu3u agony auntMy goodness I can't believe you are still with this women. Why would you like to be with someone who doesn't love you for who you are and then tells you that wants another person to be involve in her sex life? I couldn't be with someone like that. Someone that is suppose to love you would not be treating you this way. If your wife is not happy with you and treats you this way you shouldn't have to deal with it. Is so weird that all of the sudden she is acting this way with you. You should really talk to her about this and see a therapist together and if she doesn't want to do this, this means she does not care about your relationship and you should really consider if you want to live with someone like this for the rest of your life. Best of luck to you.

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A female reader, bunnyblueeyes United Kingdom +, writes (27 December 2011):

bunnyblueeyes agony auntI'm not sure what your advisor thought we would do? I don't think they understand women very well!!

But on to your question. You definately should not have to live in a celibate and unaffectionate life.

Talk to your wife and explain that you want her to see a therapist because you cannot live out the rest of your life like this.

If she refuses you may have to ask yourself 'does she really want to be in this

Relationship.'

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