A
male
age
18-21,
anonymous
writes:I just had a very interesting conversation with my gf. Lately I've been bothered by a lot of stuff in our relationship. Let me preface this by saying that I love her very much and vice versa. I grew up in a nice little white bread town where everyone is rich and full of bs. I personally hated it. Out of this growing up experience I was always the goodie two shoes, nice guy. I was too nervous to kiss a girl without asking first b/c I was afraid of them not wanting me to kiss them and getting upset. I always put such a high priority on romance but never got any. I had two relationships in high school. One which lasted a month, consisted of nothing but making out and ended because I wasn't interested in her that much. My second one lasted for a year and a few months but most of it was away at college and ended because she was completely possessive and demanding. As a demonstration of how my mind works I actually got depressed over my ending of that relationship. After I got over it I couldn't understand what made me get so down over her. My gf grew up in a fairly rough area. She has tons of bad experiences. She's spent the better part of her high school and college years in a relationship. She's slept with 2 of her bfs and done some interesting things sexually. She claims that it was because she was looking for anything that would keep her in a relationship even though they were both bad relationships and they treated her very badly.Needless to say she is quite a bit more sexually experienced than me. It's always something that has bothered me (just the fact that I only have a little experience with that). She has told me about certain things she did, even though she didn't really want to, with her exes. Many of them I'm interested in doing with her. This is partially because I have never done some of these things and would like to experience them. It's also partially because her exes were both terrible people who treated her like dirt and I am bothered by the idea of her doing things with them that she hasn't done with me (I know this sounds kind of stupid but I can't help that it bothers me).These kinds of things include oral, having sex in a public place (not in front of a crowd but like in the park where no one is or something like that). She says that she doesn't want to do them because she doesn't feel comfortable. I told her that it bothers me and she said that she does feel upset because she feels like she treated her exes too well and isn't giving me enough but she doesn't want to have to do something she's really uncomfortable with. She says that it's because she has more respect for herself now and she feels differently about me than them. She also feels bad because I felt led on. She had insinuated that she would do some of these things with me and then way later on casually said she changed her mind. She has negative associations with her exes because of the things she was pushed into and she doesn't want that same association with me. I've explained to her that logically I understand and I think she's right. But that doesn't stop it from upsetting me. Part of why I'm so bothered is because I think she might be someone I want to end up with. But I feel as though if she is "it" then I won't ever get to experience some of those things and I'll always have images in my head of her doing this with her exes. When we talked about the fact that she feels differently now I explained to her that I'm tired of feeling like the nice guy who gets screwed out of things b/c she's not an ass who pushes for it. This has happened before. I date/or befriend a girl who has emotional baggage and has poor self esteem and I am the knight in shining armor. Then I am forced to deal with all the emotional baggage and I end up getting a worse deal than the jerk ex's because they suddenly develop self worth. Don't get me wrong, I don't want them to continue to feel bad about themselves. But this just keeps reminding me "nice guys finish last." It just reminds me that they would do this for/with their jackass exes but wouldn't do it with me. I explained to her that the argument that it's b/c she feels differently about me doesn't make me feel better. For me it's about the same as if someone said to their significant other "I love you so much, more than anyone I've ever been with. I love you so much I don't think that we need to have physical affection. We don't need to kiss or hold hands or have sex ever because our love is better than that." I appreciate it but I keep feeling like I get the bad deal. I am constantly feeling bad that.I want to be with her but I'm getting sick of being the nice guy who never gets what he wants b/c he has to help ever gf with her mountains of emotional baggage and give them the most perfect relationship I can. We both don't know what to do. She has always been nervous that I would lose interest so every now and then she will get insecure about it. A month or so ago she had mentioned that if I needed a break I could have one. She said "do you want a break from me? I'm not going anywhere or remotely interested in anyone else, so i guess if you need one, just let me know, and I'll wait." I have thought that perhaps that would be a way to fix things but that brings up other possible problems. If we go on a break and she hooks up with a guy...or multiple, then I will probably be even more bothered and at that point would not want to get back together (I know this is very hypocritical of me but I honestly can't control what bothers me and I can't handle that). The other possibility is that she resents me for it.Please I am in very desperate need of advice. How can we fix this situation?
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a break, depressed, get back together, her ex, I love you, insecure, self esteem Reply to this Question |
Fancy yourself as an agony aunt? Add your answer to this question! A
male
reader, tryingtofigurethisout  +, writes (26 April 2009):
I am in the EXACT same situation that I am the nice guy who does his best to make a perfect relationship and I know she has done certain things with exes. I even know my girlfriend enjoys giving oral but has not done so with me in the 4 months we've been together.
I feel like SHIT. The problem is I'm constantly seeing her and falling for her and then when I'm not with her I resent her SO MUCH.
I haven't tried to communicate with my girlfriend as you have so I admire you but I am afraid to ask her why she won't because as you have stated, it hasn't helped.
A
female
reader, lotus mama808 +, writes (31 March 2009):
 But would it be so bad if the relationship didnt resume? Honestly, it is hard to get serious with someone when you are not quite comfertable with yourself. It seems you are not truly satisfied being who you are, and it might be the best thing to let this girl go and work on yourself for a while. I'm not saying you need to be fixed, I'm saying it might be a good idea for you to do some soul searching. (don't we all, lol). If you are complete and whole with the person you are, finding the "one" will be a sinch, trust me. You are uncomfertable with things about this girl you can not change because of the way you are. These things won't just go away in your mind, and thats why I think it might be a good thing to just cruise solo, have fun, explore, travel, expand, experiment!
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A
male
reader, Yos  + ♥, writes (31 March 2009):
 "I'm starting to think that the best way for this to get resolved is if we take a break. The only thing is that I'm then scared of being put in a situation where the relationship either never resumes or it is damaged by the break. That's really what I'm struggling with."
That's not what you're really struggling with. You're really struggling with the thoughts and feelings that occur when you think about her past.
If you want to be with her, a break makes no sense. A break isn't going to achieve anything other than introduce new doubts that she might do something with someone else.
Decide whether or not you want to be with her. I don't mean 'forever', but now, and for the near term. If you do, resolve to overcome this and take the steps you need to. And if you don't then end it, but end it properly and with respect, rather than leaving it hanging.
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A
female
reader, rhythmandblues2 + ♥, writes (31 March 2009):
 Those are the risks you take for making such a big deal out of your sexual experiences and hers.....really dude, this is an age old problem for young couples...someone invariably is always less experienced.....it depends on your values and your beliefs....do you value sex over relationship, is she a slut in your eyes, are you a team or are you going to be in competition with her over everything, it is as plain as the nose on your face.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (31 March 2009): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionTisha, the one comment that you made about me only wanting to do these things with her isn't really true. Granted I would prefer to do these things with her b/c I love her, but honestly I'm starting to think that the best way for this to get resolved is if we take a break. The only thing is that I'm then scared of being put in a situation where the relationship either never resumes or it is damaged by the break. That's really what I'm struggling with.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (31 March 2009): You know, I've been the girl that was pressured into stuff I really didn't want to do. And I see a sliver of hope for you. It's 1 word- Patience. If she's REALLY worth it to you, and you give her some TIME to feel:
Safe
Secure
Loved by You,
she might be like me, and DO what you want because she'll WANT to, because you Waited for her to be READY,
UNLIKE the other jerks that made it a BAD experience.
TELL her, YOU want to be there for her to help her heal from the hurt. When you take the 1st step to make her feel safe and loved, eventually, she's going to want to please you.
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A
male
reader, Yos + ♥, writes (31 March 2009):
"I know this is very hypocritical of me but I honestly can't control what bothers me and I can't handle that"
At least you recognize this as hypocritical. However, you also need to admit that this is also wrong, and a major cause of your issues. I apologise in advance that the rest of this answer will be rather... direct.
You, quite simply, CAN control what bothers you. And you CAN handle that.
Right now you are being passive. You are disassociating yourself from your emotions and your responsibility for them, and hence not 'owning' this problem. Only by stepping up and taking direct, full, personal responsibility for this will you overcome it. Which you can do, should you wish to and choose to.
The problem you'll find is that this passiveness is tied into your self-image and the excuses you are giving for your feelings. It's your passiveness that has led to your sexual experiences (or lack of them) so far. And it's your passiveness that has led to your being a 'nice guy that finishes last'. This behaviour, this self-image, and your current emotions towards your girlfriend, are all part of the same thing. Namely...
You are not taking direct ownership of your emotions, your relationship and your behaviour. You are hiding and avoiding. To put it in crude terms, you need to 'man up'.
I have some advice for you to follow. I give this advice because I myself have been in a similar situation to you, and have had similar issues, and these things helped:
- Take full responsibility for this. These thoughts and feelings are yours, not your girlfriends. Accept you are 100% 'responsible', and stop rationalizing your way out of taking personal ownership
- Don't blame your girlfriend. Don't put her down, don't lay your insecurities on her, and and don't lay passive-aggressive traps (eg: "we can go on a break but if you sleep with someone I won't be able to handle it")
- Decide whether you want to be with her. If you do, then that also means you've agreed to get over this. Don't allow yourself to get sucked into the misguided internal rationale and behavioural justifications it creates. Staying with her means this is over. But if you want to leave her, do it now and don't look back.
If you decide to stay there are many more positive steps you can take to overcome the obsessive thoughts about her past. Please look at my post history, and also the history of Troubledtoomuch, for more suggestions.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (31 March 2009): I think your the one with the problem not her. Your obsession with doinbg everything with her sexually that she has done with past boyfriends would be no doubt boring her to tears.
Does she insist that you relive every wingle one of your past sexual experiances with her? I dont think so.
My advice is GROW UP!
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A
female
reader, rhythmandblues2 + ♥, writes (31 March 2009):
With all due respect to the OP, this is the third time you have posted this question but worded it a bit differently.
You have had the time and attention and advice of aunts who have tried to help you, and some to try and make you think.
There is no solution to your problem. It is something that you have to decide to come to terms with on your own.
You have a certain belief system in my opinion that may not be healthy for you or at the very least is at war with your current girlfriend and your relationship. You have this belief that there is something to be resentful about towards girlfriends with more and varied sexual experience than you have, and that nice guys finish last....so you judge her for doing those things Before she met you and you judge yourself for not being cool enough or hot enough to get those girls that would do those sexual things with you.....as if that would be a measure of your manhood.
These are your beliefs, no one elses, and if they work for you great...but your solution here is probably to break up with your girlfriend, or take that break and go out whoring around......but like Tisha points out, it won't resolve the cognitive dissonance you have because it is part of your belief system and how you judge her and your relationship going forward.....and how you have a double standard for women and for men.
You can't change the past, all you can do is to decide to move forward with a clean slate...you have to decide if your love for each other is enough to wipe the slate clean and never look back and go on with your life together and the sex life that she and you are both comfortable with.
If you can't do that, then get off the pot and make a decision already and stop asking the world to tell you what to do.
We can't change your belief system and you don't have to change it if you don't want to...if you are comfortable living this way with your particular beliefs then keep going on without your girlfriend because you will never resolve this with her. You have to resolve it with you, it is your inner demons at play here, not hers, she knows what she wants to do and what she doesn't want to do, it's you who isn't clear.
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A
female
reader, Tisha-1 + ♥, writes (31 March 2009):
 I understand that you haven't been pushing her to do anything she doesn't want to do, that you are here looking for an answer as to how to resolve your feelings about this issue, correct? You're not here looking for advice on how to get her to play out sexual activities she has specifically told you she doesn't want to engage in any longer, even though she never did them with you, right?
Your original question is "how can we fix this situation?" I'm not sure you're going to like what I have to say here, but here goes.
She's not the one with the problem. You are. She doesn't have to do anything to fix the situation. You do.
She’s not responsible for your previous crappy relationships, nor does she have to somehow make up for what you missed out on with those women. She has no atonement to do for you being a “nice guy” nor for your being depressed about the ending of the last one. (I frankly would have guessed that you’d be relieved to break up with a possessive and demanding girlfriend.)
Her failing was in telling you so much detail about her previous sexual experiences. [Here, you wrote an ambiguous statement: “She has told me about certain things she did, even though she didn't really want to, with her exes. Many of them I'm interested in doing with her.” This could be taken to mean that she told you even though she didn’t want to tell you. Do you see how that could be read that way?] From what you've written, if she hadn't mentioned anything specific about what she'd done with the exes, you'd be no wiser and thus wouldn't have had these fantasies planted in your head? Or is it possible that at some point, you would have seen/heard about something sexual that you would like to try, and that you would have been told "no" by her to that activity?
You spend a lot of time trying to distinguish yourself from the jackasses that she has been with. You do recognize that if you push her into doing something she doesn't want to, that if you coerce her through emotional blackmail, that you then join the ranks of the jackasses? You lose your good boy status. And then, if the relationship doesn't survive, she'll be adding you to that list of guys who made her do things she really wasn't comfortable with--she'll be naming you as one of those guys to the next boyfriend.
In fact, that's really the problem here, isn't it? You're struggling with wanting to be the good guy, but having the desires and fantasies that the jackasses did. That must be making you crazy.
You're not getting a 'bad deal', you're getting the part of sexuality that she is willing and prepared to share with you. That she doesn't want to have sex in public now doesn't make her some sort of bitch for "holding out" on you. She just doesn't want to have sex in public any more. She tried it once, maybe because she was coerced into it, maybe because she thought she was going to lose the guy. So if she goes ahead and says, fine, let's have sex in public, then she's doing it not because she wants to, but because she's been emotionally blackmailed into it. If she's so desperate to hang on to the guy--you in this case--then she'll regret it again if the relationship fails. She'll only have done it this time because you demanded she do so to prove she loves you. I know, you haven't asked her outright to do it now, but by telling her your feelings on this matter, you are in essence making that request.
I think you do need to take a close look at this “knight in shining armor” image that you’ve put forth as what you think you are. Why do I say that? Because of some of the words you’ve chosen to describe things: “tired of feeling like the nice guy who gets screwed out of things”, “I am forced to deal with all the emotional baggage, and I end up getting a worse deal than the jerk ex’s because they suddenly develop self worth.” You told us about only two previous relationships, and neither of them sound like you were the nice guy getting screwed out of anything. I think you subconsciously believe you deserve to have these sexual acts with her because you’ve done all this emotional support work for her; it’s like a payback for all the psychic energy you’ve put into the relationship.
And forgive me for being a bit incredulous about your analogy with “I love you so much, we never have to touch each other again.” That’s ridiculous, and you know it. Take it to the other extreme and you can see how absurd it really is: “I love you so much, we have to touch each other in all the ways two human beings can touch each other, inside and out.” I don’t want to cast aspersions on anyone’s lovemaking, but let me take this as a possible counteroffer she might make. “Look, honey, I really want to experience this with you: [insert sex act you have no interest in and a bit of repugnance to doing—I don’t want to make any assumptions here].” I know, I know, she’s done these things with the exes, so it’s not like she’s a virgin, right? But she HATED them. Why would you make her do something she hated, just so you can feel a little bit better? And having done this for you, wouldn’t she feel that much worse about you? That you’d be sitting right there in the pantheon of jackasses?
So I go back to this thought, this impression I get from you. You said really early on in the question: “Lately I've been bothered by a lot of stuff in our relationship.” And “a lot of stuff” turns out to be that she doesn’t want to do sexual stuff she hated doing with you. Your story about growing up and the goodie two shoes aspect of you… I hesitate to tell you this, but goodie two shoes nice guys DO kiss without asking. You were simply nervous and insecure—this does not automatically make you a nice guy. Sorry.
So now that I’ve pretty much demolished the notion that you are a nice guy, what do we have left? We have a guy, a human being, who wants to preserve the image of being a nice guy, but who really wants to be a bad boy, a bad boy being the guy who gets the hot women who are willing to do ANYTHING with their man. Basically, you’re a guy. And as lotusmomma pointed out, you’re a guy who is choosing the wrong women for him.
I think job one for you is working on your own self-esteem—don’t play out this scenario you’re proposing with your girlfriend. This scenario that pits you against the exes in the body of your girlfriend as the arena, that you “win” somehow by getting her to do the things she has explicitly told you she no longer wants to do. This is ego-stroking on a very hurtful scale. Your ego at the expense of hers.
She’s basically given you permission to go out and do these things with other women, so that you don’t feel ‘deprived’ of the experience, by suggesting that you two go on a break. But it’s not about the experience in and of itself, is it? It’s about the experience with HER. She doesn’t want to do it. You do. I don’t see any way out of this other than a split. Or you get yourself some help and work through this issue on your own. Again, she doesn’t “owe” you these experiences.
If you can’t going through life without having some of whatever it is you feel you’re missing out on now, then you are definitely with the wrong woman. You’re still young, she’s still young, your relationship is still young. In most cases, your sex life is as hot and passionate and experimental as it’s going to be right now. [I say ‘in most cases’ because in some relationships, people do open themselves up to experimentation and grow deeper and closer in love and the sexual expression of that love. But not in all, I think.]
You have to figure this out yourself. This is your problem, not hers.
[I feel for you on the oral issue, by the way. But not the sex in public thing—that’s just not necessary.]
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (31 March 2009): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionok...it looks like i didn't make myself clear on this...
...I DO NOT WANT HER TO DO ANYTHING SHE DOESN'T WANT TO!!!!!
I have told her this and frankly I wouldn't get any enjoyment from her doing something purely to please me. I'm not trying to push her into this. I'm trying to decide if I should sit back and hope one day it goes away or if I should move on right now. If I stick around and it never gets better then I have spent years on something which has only made me miserable and will have nothing good come of it. If I walk now then I lose this girl and I will wonder if I could have eventually gotten over it.
And for the record I have been going to therapy for about 18 months now.
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A
female
reader, lotus mama808 +, writes (31 March 2009):
It takes more than words to be one of the "good guys". Unfortunately for you, the "good guys" are exactly that without needing to boast about it, or hold it against their partners. I am sorry if this sounds like nothing you want to hear, but stand up people don't use it as an excuse to get what they want.
As for your lady, I don't feel she has any serious issues, I think your nack for finding a good mate is not quite that good. You are damaged, and therefore you are seeking out damaged goods. If you are not happy with your life hon, change it. It isn't up to her to change it, she is simply being herself. You need to change it. Maybe she isnt the "one" for you, and what you would be more compatable with is a girl with a more solid head on her shoulders. Humble yourself just a little, and realize that you are only human. It's awsome that you believe you are better than some of the more jerky guys, but it is kind of jerky to complain that your partner isn't what you want her to be because of it, you know?
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (31 March 2009): From your reply to InterCntlCHmp, it seems like you're the sort who doesn't want to hear advice if it isn't what you've already decided in your head is right. I completely agree with InterCntlCHmp however.
She had some bad times sexually with ex's she would rather forget (sounds like you wouldn't let up til she talked about them) and you want her to do those exact same things with you, so you can feel you measure up to them or something? Think about how awful it must feel for her, that the man she's said she'd like to wed one day is trying to coerce her into sex acts she has said she's no longer comfortable with trying. The fact that she's said she's not comfortable should be enough for any decent man.
If it's not good enough for you, I suggest you find yourself another girl and leave your girlfriend alone to find a man who won't push her into something she doesn't want. Putting your sexual desires ahead of her happiness is no way to behave in a relationship.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (30 March 2009): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionInterCntlCHmp you either don't get what I'm saying or have no clue about anything on this subject. I have spent 11 1/2 months without bringing this stuff up just to keep her happy. I've, by her own admission, made her happier than she's ever been before.
Also you must not have read it or I must not have made it clear, I don't want her to do anything she doesn't want to. But it still bothers me. All I was doing was letting her know it bothered me. As for me forcing her to talk about her past, I don't know where you got that idea from but that's not true. She told me most of it without me having to so much as ask.
Also, don't call me a douche bag or a fool over this; it doesn't help anyone. You are just so wrong it's laughable. I do nothing but think about her wants and desires. It's only been the last couple months that I've been letting these feeling surface. But at some point don't you think that me staying in a relationship that drives me crazy just for someone else isn't really healthy for either of us?
As for figuring out what's causing this, I thought I made it pretty clear but it has mostly to due with the fact that I couldn't land a girl to save my life in high school, I had a terrible experience dating up until the last year or so when suddenly I'm in a relationship with a girl who I love more than anything and think that I might end up with her; except I haven't gotten the chance to experience the things I would have liked to.
All this thanks to my "peachy upbringing" which I hated more than anything. You're terrible at advice and even worse at being compassionate for anyone else.
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A
male
reader, InterCntlCHmp  +, writes (30 March 2009):
Respect your girl. Don't be such a whiney douche bag over your own lack of experience(YOUR FAULT NOT HERS! SHE OWE"S YOU NOTHING). You are a young guy so I'm not going to completely lose the plot on you for being such a fool but seriously man Think about her feeling and desires.You mentioned she didn't want to tell you things from her sexual past. Did you force her to?You know in her past relationships the guys where dicks to her. So maybe you should start to think about where her head was at when she was having sex with her ex's rather than getting her to relive the same shitty experiences with YOU.You can't control what bothers you but you can certainly start to look at why it bothers you and hopefully realize you have way more emotional/ sexual issues than this girl despite your peachy upbringing.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (30 March 2009): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionI'm sure she doesn't want me as a friend...she's made several hints that she would like to marry me someday
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A
female
reader, CherryCupcake +, writes (30 March 2009):
Have you ever thought she may be considering you as a friend? Im not being awful but it seems as though she prefers you as one.
Tbh, i think she needs to see a doctor, explain the way she feels and maybe get some profesional help.
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