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My boyfriend is very casual about his daughters' privacy and I find it very very odd

Tagged as: Big Questions, Family, Troubled relationships<< Previous question   Next question >>
Question - (18 May 2019) 21 Answers - (Newest, 27 May 2019)
A female United States age 30-35, anonymous writes:

Ive been seeing a guy who's super awesome. We're both single parents of two girls each. They stay the night frequently. My girls are 9 and 13, his are 9 and 11. Despite having lived in an all girl house for the last 5 years or so, my daughters and I are hardly ever naked around each other. Not that I've never ever change around my daughters, they learn a womens body through me, i just raised them to seek privacy when changing showering etc. I find it odd that he still assists them with showers and changing clothes. Sometimes he even goes in the bathroom to make sure they're using the toilet alright. Hes very casual about it. And we were having a deep talk about raising young ladies one night etc and he said something along the lines of wanting to get them female soaps because he thinks regular soaps make their body parts smell bad. He worded it in a way that kinda implied he still attends to their rearends even though they aren't exactly toddlers anymore. I don't want to offend him but i don't want to sleep on how unusual it just seems. My dads were never like that with me. Though they were great dads. So i came here for feedback to see if it's a cultural difference or if it seems odd to anyone else. At what age should a father teach his daughters about body privacy? At what age did your dad stop helping you change clothes

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A female reader, Youcannotbeserious United Kingdom + , writes (27 May 2019):

Youcannotbeserious agony auntI'd like to throw a different light on this. Bear with me because it comes from my own experience, as I will share later. Unlike some of the uncles and aunts, I am going to give this man the benefit of the doubt, in the absence of any EVIDENCE to the contrary, and ASSUME he is just misguided and overprotective of his daughters.

Nobody is born knowing how to be a parent. Ask any parent and, if they are honest, most will tell you they learned as they went alone, with a lot of input from various sources. If they were lucky enough to have their own parents around, then they will usually have been taught a lot by them once their own children came along. If not, then from other family members, friends, books, doctors or the internet. I doubt ANY parent ever got it 100% right! I am sure all made mistakes as they went along. Perhaps this man has had bad advice, or no advice at all, and is just doing what he thinks a mother would do. I AGREE 100% that he is OUT OF ORDER but maybe, just maybe, there is nothing malicious going on and he is just doing his (misguided) best in the absence of better advice.

I say this because my own partner nearly bit my head off when his daughter got her first boyfriend at the age of 15 (weeks off 16) and I suggested he discussed contraception with her (her mother was not on the scene at this point due to mental health issues). He told me, in no uncertain terms, that they were "just children and not doing that sort of thing". I swear he used those very words! It took a worried phone call from me to his sister and a very heated telephone call to him from her for him to have the conversation with his daughter. Guess what? OF COURSE they were having sex. Luckily she was honest and told him. She also admitted they were not always using protection! After a bit of discussion and research, a quick trip to the doctor's got her a contraceptive implant (it was agreed, by her and her father, that she would probably "forget" to take a daily pill), and unexpected pregnancies were thus avoided. However, if her father had NOT had guidance in this area, he would have assumed she was still his little girl and "not doing that sort of thing" and we could have had a pregnant 16 year old to deal with.

Now my partner is quite intelligent and sensible in most areas of life. Held down a very responsible job all his working life. Can turn his hand to many things. Can strip down, rebuild and modify a complicated engine. Possesses most skills to renovate houses. However, nobody taught him how to be a parent to a teenage girl and nobody warned him how quickly they "mature" these days. (The situation was further complicated by her mother being in and out of her life due to her own health issues.)

I totally agree that sniffing your daughter's underwear sounds creepy but perhaps he does this because he does not KNOW it is creepy. Perhaps he is genuinely checking to make sure they are healthy. If there is a strong smell on their underwear, then they need to be checked out by a doctor to make sure there is no medical reason, like VB, which is very common and can cause a strong odour. This can be easily checked for with a quick swab and easily treated with a course of antibiotics. Problem solved. One of the common causes of VB is over-washing of the vaginal area, especially with soaps. Given what you have already said, I would suspect this could very well be happening.

I do hope he listens to his daughter when she tells him she feels it is creepy. That is very important. She feels uncomfortable with his actions and he should respect her feelings. If she mentions it to one of her friends and they mention it to a parent or teacher, he could end up in serious trouble.

I hope this helps.

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A female reader, anonymous, writes (22 May 2019):

No no no.Listen to your gut mom as this is beyond creepy.Keep your girls far far away from him.Break up with him.Call child protective services and report him.This in no way is normal there is something unsavory going on here and you know it...Listen to that gut of yours.Never ever introduce a man to your girls for at least a year or even more.Then when you do never leave them alone with any man you do really not know ever no matter how hot he is or how good he is in bed.He smells their underware? I would have been far gone from that situation and calling cps right then.If you do not call cps on him you must live with knowing and putting his girls in danger as well as other girls.As a mom I cannot understand why you put your girls in danger like this.Just why?

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A female reader, Andie's Thoughts United Kingdom +, writes (21 May 2019):

Andie's Thoughts agony auntBrownWolf, privacy is a big thing all across the world - not just North America :) Dads with no creepy behaviours don’t sniff their daughters laundry and *deliberately* walk in on them.

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A male reader, BrownWolf Canada +, writes (21 May 2019):

BrownWolf agony auntSorry to say....But only in North America is this idea of privacy a thing. I grew up in the Caribbean. I ran around naked everytime it rained. All the kids, boys and girls did the same thing. We only became private when we understood the changes in our bodies.

Parents did not care, because being naked was part of life. So many people in North America can't have sex with the lights on, because they don't want to be seen naked. Others are ashamed even to be seen in a bathing suit. Go outside North America an see if that is an issue.

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A female reader, Anonymous 123 Italy +, writes (21 May 2019):

Anonymous 123 agony auntThis is beyond creepy. A father sniffing his daughters dirty underwear and checking for odour is definitely not normal under any stretch of imagination.

I'm sorry but I'd be on the way out. Keep in mind that you have two daughters as well and you have no clue what he's doing as far as they're concerned. Soon all the young ladies will get their periods and develop breasts. What will be do then? Measure their cup size? Check their sanitary napkins?

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A reader, anonymous, writes (21 May 2019):

You can't live in the same house and never run into a family-member naked from time to time. Let's not split hairs just to make a point!

My father never entered the bathroom when my sisters were 9 and 11. My mom never entered the bathroom when I was that age unless she knocked, or we were covered. They changed our diapers when we were babies. They new when we were entitled to some dignity and privacy; and taught us to treat each other with the same respect for each-others privacy.

It has nothing to do with body-shame; it's about what isn't healthy, or disrespectful at a certain chronological-age during a child's formative-years. Just because some dad's do it, doesn't make it right! Some dad's are pedophiles! Not to alarm you, nor to imply that is the case here.

It is so a big-deal if a father is regularly seeing his daughters undressed and inviting himself into the bathroom when they are fully exposed; and haven't had a chance to cover themselves. If it happens frequently, the question is why?

Our society is becoming very dismissive of things that are totally inappropriate; and that's how children are unable to tell when something isn't right! When you blur the lines or make them feel their judgement or discomfort is trumped by the will of adults on every topic; you confuse them and things can happen to them that they are totally unaware might be bordering on molestation.

You don't panic, because he IS both a father and mother to those girls. It was good that you mentioned it, and let him know you're mildly concerned. You're a mother, and a woman. You know what's appropriate between girls and their fathers; and what is not!!! You know what is appropriate around your daughters!

I reiterate, they are too old for their father to be checking their underpants and walking in on them undressed. You've informed him so. They are his daughters, and no one has a right to question his parenting; unless something is wrong beyond any shadow of a doubt. If someday you plan to blend families; you bet this matters!

I know one thing, you wouldn't want your daughter's father walking in on them, or checking their underwear for odor. Would you? Little-girls who bath or shower regularly; have no detectable odor. If they don't have an infection and aren't menstruating, they shouldn't have an odor.

Maybe they should be reminded to always wear clean underwear. That might be an adequate fatherly-suggestion; until they are old enough to know better.

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A female reader, anonymous, writes (20 May 2019):

I would be totally creeped out. I would be worried there was more going on as it's so bizarre. A man smelling his daughters underwear is downright wrong. Anyone smelling anyone's underwear is downright wrong. The fact that his own daughter called him creepy is even more telling. It shows that they are aware that this is not normal behaviour

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A female reader, Andie's Thoughts United Kingdom +, writes (20 May 2019):

Andie's Thoughts agony auntYeah, no. Family differences aren't cultural. He's clueless, but he could look online for advice. He IS being creepy. Girls are MEANT to smell a little down below; our bodies clean themselves out. Their father is not supposed to do anything other than wash their clothes. Definitely NOT smell them or walk in while they're using the bathroom!

I'd have a firm chat with him as soon as you've spoken to the girls, regardless of what they say.

I have never heard of a single culture where it is normal for the parents, but especially the father, to bathe or walk in on the daughters past the age of about 6. He needs to stop or I would call someone to investigate him and see if that shows him why it's wildly inappropriate.

To be honest, he can't be so oblivious as to why this is creepy and unacceptable. There is NO WAY he truly believes that smelling his daughters' underwear is okay or normal. Most fathers respect their daughters enough to give them privacy and wouldn't feel comfortable walking in on them anyway. This is serious, OP.

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A female reader, anonymous, writes (20 May 2019):

This is super super weird.Don't ignore the red flags. I'd be getting my ass out of there and calling a social worker on my way out.

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A female reader, Ciar Canada + , writes (19 May 2019):

Ciar agony auntYour boyfriend's involvement in bathing his daughter and checking on them while they're using the washroom is weird.

I'd be hard pressed to find any culture in which men practiced this with their daughters. In societies all over the world throughout the ages it was always women who were this involved with young children and I can't think of any mothers washing their daughters at this age.

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A reader, anonymous, writes (19 May 2019):

This is verified as being by the original poster of the question

I'm the op. We talked further after he told his daughter to start using wet wipes because she had odor down there. I asked how he knew that and he said from their dirty underwear. His daughter called him a creepy dad after he said that and i explained to him that a girls dirty underwear is a private thing and to not be checking them. Then we continued talking and i mentioned i thought they should be more private at their age and he said they also see him naked at times as well. He says he tries to avoid it if possible but it seems to me like they can hardly use the toilet without him going in there and the odor thing disturbed me the most. I just, as a daughter of two sets of parents, have no memory whatsoever of my dads naked aside from boxers. And as a mother, never checked my daughters odor etc. He seemed to sway with the comment i made about it being hard to be mom and dad but then i told him not to think so much about it, girls are like raising boys aside from maxipads later on and that more than anything they need privacy in that department. I'm waiting to talk to the kids for a chance alone to do so and keeping an eye out for redflags. Hoping he just needed advice.

The cultural difference i was referring to was the typical differences that vary from family to family

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A male reader, CMMP United States +, writes (19 May 2019):

I see my daughters (9 and 11) naked on occasion and neither I nor they feel it's a big deal. To be honest I think by making it a big deal people are being kind of weird. I have absolutely no sexual attraction/desire for my daughters in any way, and suggesting that there's something wrong with seeing someone naked on occasion makes it sound as if you shouldn't see them naked so you don't get tempted or something. It's just nudity.

That being said their mom and I taught them how to shower and wipe a long time ago so them not being more independent is weird.

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A reader, anonymous, writes (19 May 2019):

It's inappropriate and he knows it. If he doesn't, as a mother and a female you should say so. They're too old for him go into the bathroom, or be around them when they're changing.

Say something, or your girls may be exposed to the same inappropriate behavior.

I don't care what part of the world they're from, or what culture; they are too old for their father to see them unclothed. There are only a few exceptions. Such as a medical situation; or some sort of physical injury. Under normal circumstances, it's uncouth!

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A male reader, anonymous, writes (18 May 2019):

Sounds definitely like a cultural thing in combination with some (many, actually) dads being total suckers for their daughters. Those dads think their daughters are innocent little babies forever. They can't think of their daughters being grown up and being sexual beings. I would be worried about such a man regarding only one thing. They can't handle it well when their daughters become adults and go out with boys... they will kinda be suspicious like the boys are trying to trick their little babies and take away their innocence or something. I hope your guy would not be one of those extreme doting dads. Other than that guys like this would generally be amazing human beings. You yourself said he is super awesome. Good luck!

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A female reader, chigirl Norway +, writes (18 May 2019):

chigirl agony auntIf you ask about cultural differences, please inform us what cultures you are both from. Otherwise I can not comment on that. As for «formale soaps», there is no such thing. What body parts smell funny? Maybe he means their armpits and they actually need to use deodorant? This is just all way too vague. Please be more specific. As it stands, it could mean anything between earth and sky and I would not pay it attention.

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A male reader, anonymous, writes (18 May 2019):

Normally children are supposed to be tought to use the toilets by themselves by the time they attend school or even kindergarten, however I think that the father perhaps was forced to attend to their pathing and toilet needs because probably the mother refused to do it. Yes their are mothers who are revolted by the idea of wiping and cleaning of their babies leaving no choice either for the father to do this by himself or employ a nanny. I suggest you discuss this with him and work on teaching his daughters to rely on themselves. Certainly it is not normal for the father to do this to such late age.

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A female reader, Andie's Thoughts United Kingdom +, writes (18 May 2019):

Andie's Thoughts agony auntHe should not be washing or dressing them, full stop. I don't know of a culture where spending time around your naked daughter after 6 or 7 years old is normal. By that age, if you're worried about them, you stand outside a closed door, not in there with them. You certainly don't go anywhere near their private parts. Also, soaps shouldn't be used around that area either.

Definitely ask him why he does is and explain that girls that age need privacy, not naked help from their dad. Be polite about it, but make it clear that it's inappropriate and I wouldn't advise you stay if he refuses to accept it.

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A female reader, Youcannotbeserious United Kingdom + , writes (18 May 2019):

Youcannotbeserious agony auntIt's pointless asking others for their experiences as everyone's childhood is different. For instance, my brother and I were raised almost solely by my mum for the first few years as dad used to work long hours and we only saw him at week-ends or holidays so it was only really mum who was involved in helping us wash and dress. However, I do remember bathing myself from a much earlier age than 9.

At 9 and 11, I personally think the girls are WAY too old to be having their father that intimately involved in their showering and dressing. His deep involvement could be more for HIS benefit than for theirs, i.e. maybe he feels he has to make up for their mother not being around and is finding it hard to let them grow up?

As you know, children need to learn to do things for themselves. He is doing them no favours by not allowing them to make their own choices and decisions. After all, they are at school during the day and obviously cope fine without his involvement.

I do find the whole soap thing creepy. 9 and 11 year olds should definitely be tending their own "rearends". Also he should not be pushing "female soaps" at girls this age. Healthy clean bodies regulate themselves. Soaps should never be used on intimate parts. (Also worries my slightly how he KNOWS they "smell bad" and I really don't want to start guessing on that one.)

You imply he is from a different culture than you but, even so, this does not sit right. It MAY just be that he is being misguidedly protective as a single parent but there could be other creepier stuff going on.

In your shoes I would try to casually chat with his daughters, without making it obvious you are pumping for information, and just see if they say anything which rings alarm bells. I would also be saying things to him like "In my experience, girls of this age should be . . . . ". Parents often complain their children grow up too quickly. Perhaps he just hasn't realized HOW quickly. I do hope this is ALL that is going on.

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A female reader, Anonymous 123 Italy +, writes (18 May 2019):

Anonymous 123 agony auntWhen I first read the question, my instant thought was it's certainly not normal and it if you ask me, it's downright creepy and strange. There are some things that are just understood and that needn't be spelt out and this issue of privacy of one of them.

That being said, I wonder if this has to do with the fact that their mother or a female figure, any female figure, is completely absent from the daughters' lives. Is that so? Because maybe then I could maybe try to see things from his perspective, that he's been the mother AND the father for them and that's why there are no gender boundaries. Although even then it's not really normal, because I'm sure there are gay fathers out there bringing up daughters and I'm hoping or at least pretty sure no one does that!

Also, why he still washes their private parts is still very questionable to me. I don't think that even a mother would do that for a 9 year old or an 11 year old. That you need to ask him.

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A female reader, Honeypie United States + , writes (18 May 2019):

Honeypie agony auntNope, nope and nope.

The girls are ALL old enough to bathe themselves and dress themselves and honestly.. if they don't know how to WIPE their bums by now... I just don't know.

I don't think my dad really helped me change clothes ever. As far as I can remember. I think I was about 6-8 when I started to shower by myself, probably because that is typically the age where kids find their "modesty" and wish to be a tad more "private".

My kids don't lock the bathroom door (unless guests are over) but UNLESS they are in the shower (behind the curtain) and I NEEDED to use the rest room, and yeah that has happened, when you have 3 teenagers and ONE bathroom. But 1. I always ASK first. 2. The shower curtain is NOT see through and 3. if I'm in the shower and they need to brush teeth or go potty... They knock and ask first and I'm fine with that. 1 bathroom for 4 people... You got to find a way that works for all.

However, my husband would NEVER do that. Unless it's me in the shower, then he is fine with it.

My kids (all girls) DO lounge around in sports bras and shorts all over the house and no one cares.

I think I would talk to him and suggest that the girls (his) are OLD enough to dress, bathe etc. on their own and that it's HEALTHY to have some boundaries when it comes to this. Not JUST because he is a man but because the KIDS need to do this for themselves. I mean is he going to follow them to college and wipe bums?

I would venture a guess that he has been a single dad for a while and thus still follow the "little kid" routines.

And yes, I find it odd and a bit.. on the creepy side. I would find it creepy if their mom did it as well... It's just a little to much babying some old enough kids.

Does he also cut their meat? spoon feed them?

Because it BOTHERS you I think you should talk about it. While he MIGHT have a VERY different parenting style than you, he might also LEARN from you. As he is a dude raising GIRLS, and you are a woman doing the same. You might have (as we can see) a different perspective.

Oh and I wouldn't call him creepy when you bring it up.

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A female reader, anonymous, writes (18 May 2019):

First, Is their mother involved in theirs lives? Second, are they from a different cultural background? Answer yourself the questions before judge him.

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