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Are women too independent for men these days or have they been so mucked around by men that they have lost interest?

Tagged as: Big Questions, Dating<< Previous question   Next question >>
Question - (23 April 2014) 8 Answers - (Newest, 25 April 2014)
A male Australia age 41-50, *inky75 writes:

I was in a relationship for 20 years, it ended nearly 2 years ago.

It seems woman these days are less wanting of a man in there lives, is this right or are my values a little dated.

I like to spend time together watching movies and going out to all sorts of places, I drink socially, I like to cuddle and show my affection, I like to cook and keep my house and yard clean, I like to talk and discuss issues, I love children (have two of my own 50% of the time), I'm told I'm good looking, I love camping and I also have my own interests.

Are women too independent for men these days or have they been mucked around by men that they have lost interest?

I'm 38 and women between 35 and 45 are my age group.

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A female reader, anonymous, writes (25 April 2014):

Im 26 if i were single i would date you! But i do think you are right. Its not that women dont need a man but dont want to feel like they need a man to provide for them. Women in this day and age are independant career driven perfectionists that want to match up their lives with the kardashians, housewives etc. Shows which portrays the women as strong independant "dont need a man" type of women.

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A reader, anonymous, writes (23 April 2014):

OP I think it's a simple case of you being too picky and having too specific an idea of the woman you want and what you want from them.

I mean your age group only spans ten years and you gravitate more towards older women too.

I'd go down to 30 if I had to have an cut off like you do, but frankly I don't. Any adult woman is potential for me and I'm only a few years younger than you.

Younger than 25 for casual flings but who knows, my wife was 19 when we started dating over 8 years ago.

Go down to at least 30 if you're going to be so age restrictive, that way you have women just at the start of their biological clock freak out which makes them a tad more dependent on men and which suits you.

OP when a guy feels the need to list the things that may make him appealing to women I get the sense he's trying to promote himself as a guy who women should want, guys like that mostly are very picky then because they think highly of what they have to offer and want a woman with a similar package.

You need to let go of your expectations and restrictions and realise women have greater choice these days and dating is about discovery, so you have to remain open minded. Women who are single at the ages you want them to be are either career driven and happy being independent or are just freshly out of their own major relationships with all the baggage attached or they're a tad damaged and unappealing. You've literally picked the worst age group in which to go on the hunt and need to get rid of age as a restriction and just ask out women you like.

OP women can shop for men like they do clothes now, they only have to set up a dating profile and with mobile phones they also demand more attention so in some ways they're actually more dependent on us.

When I dated as a teenager, the only contact we had was the house phone and I was out, I was out. The only way of meeting up then was prearranging a time and you never missed it because you had no way of telling them you wouldn't make it. These days, you're expected to be available 24/7 to text or chat.

OP 30-35 is by far the best dating pool for the type of woman you want. Bio-clock desperation years where women just want to find a dependable guy to settle with. Hell I know 26 year olds who want to settle down with a dependable guy.

Open your mind and get rid of your restrictions. All you need to just start dating is that she's attractive and can hold a decent conversation. Mrs. Right is not just going to fall on your lap and frankly you'd be surprised how right a woman you didn't expect to be is if you just give dating them a shot.

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A female reader, Honeypie United States + , writes (23 April 2014):

Honeypie agony auntI think a LOT of women (and men too for that matter) have decided that finding a NEW partner is too much hassle. Dealing with ALL the baggage of a new partner in the 35+ age group is a LOT (plus they most likely have a bit of baggage themselves) - having to deal with other people's EXES, their kids, the drama.. Sometimes it's just EASIER to be single.

If I look at my BIL (he has been divorced for 8 years now) and has been dating a few ladies (who all seemed incredibly dependent and needy, frankly) and then he tried online-dating and met a few more needy ladies and when he finally found one who WANT independent she was utterly controlling. I know he feels like he just can't win.

He is not giving up though, and I think in time he WILL find someone compatible.

Don't give up and don't settle.

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A female reader, CindyCares Italy +, writes (23 April 2014):

CindyCares agony auntWomen haven't lost interest in men, of course, just , now , particularly in the age segment you mention, they can afford to be more picky and more choosy. They can support themselves ( most of the times ), there's no stigma any more about being an old spinster that nobody wanted, and by age 40 you have lived half of your life, and if you are still single, or divorced, you have also got used to , in fact quite often you are very happy with, living alone, having your own space, routines, time, money, independence,friendships, etc. It's hard to give these things up unless for someone very special, let's make it " amazing ". And what happens if you never meet someone amazing ?. Nothing bad - for many women ( not all of course ) it's not a big problem, they know that they will have a good quality of life, all in all, even without a steady partner.

In your case , though, sorry if it sounds bitchy or heartless, but , as wonderful as it is that you are a loving committed dad who has his kids at home 50% of the time, in practice it cramps your style. A woman 40 on may be looking for a partner, but not necessarily for a ready made family. Either she already lived / is living her mommy experience ,on her own and with his own, and she does not need MORE kids around her ( in fact, she is often looking forward to live kid free in a not too far future ). Or she does not have children and may not feel too cut out for the role of stepmother, which is a difficult one.

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A female reader, llifton United States +, writes (23 April 2014):

llifton agony auntOf course women aren't too independent for men. Human beings, by nature, are social creatures. And most require companionship to feel most fulfilled.

But as was touched on by youwish, I think the difference is that women no longer NEED men like they used to. They just prefer to have them out of want rather than necessity. In the united states, this is predominantly the first generation that women were out in the workforce on their own and completely independent. My parents still had those typical gender roles ingrained into them. My father was the breadwinner, and my mother stayed home with us kids. It's really only been in the last twenty years max that this has shifted here in the US. For a long time, women weren't even paid equally to men (realistically, they still aren't, but it's not like it was). So they had to rely on men to get by. They couldn't own property and were property of their husbands. So getting married was a must. Otherwise, what other options did you have?

Of course, this is not the case anymore, and women have actually been granted their independence, so women aren't forced to rely on men and settle like they used to.

I don't think they are too independent as to not want companionship. Are men too independent for women? I wouldn't say so. I just think the playing field has finally leveled. Men and women both don't "need" each other. They simply desire the company of each other equally. They can both survive without each other.

That's my two cents.

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A female reader, Anonymous 123 Italy +, writes (23 April 2014):

Anonymous 123 agony auntLots of factors here OP.

Maybe you’re doing something that’s just not appealing to the women you’re trying to date, like coming on a little too strong? Maybe the fact that you had a 20 year old relationship is something that your dates are not willing to overlook? I mean, 20 years, that’s got to have plenty of memories and baggage…you were with your partner since you were 18!

But yes, you’re right, dating isn’t easy. I don’t really *want* a man in my life per se; I mean it’s good to have one, but most women today are educated, independent and liberated. We don’t want anyone’s charity money nor do we want to be parasites on our husbands and boyfriends. Most of us loathe that kind of life anyway. We would much rather be on our own, do our own thing without being questioned and have a guy who respects us for that.

Marriage is not traditional in that sense anymore, for one because we know that it’s not forever binding upon us, the way it was maybe for our grandparents. I had asked my grandmother once, as to why divorces were unheard of in their times and she had said, that its because once you get married, you know that you *have to* be with that person for the rest of your life. There was no option but to be together so you might as well make it work. Plus women were mostly confined to the hearth and men were the ones who were working and making the money, so they knew they had to provide for their wives and children. I think that also gave them a sense of power and also a sense of responsibility for their wives and children because they knew that if they didn’t get the cash home, there would be nothing and no one to turn to. It worked like a well-oiled machine, really.

It’s completely different in the world of today. We don’t need a man to provide for us, we don’t need a man to give us his sperm and we don’t need a man to give us an orgasm.

I don’t think any of this has anything to do with how we were raised. My parents have a very happy marriage and that’s the atmosphere that I've been brought up in, yet I personally don’t want to get married and nor did I ever want to. I will, eventually, but that’ll be more for the companionship than for anything else. It has to be with someone of a similar intellectual level, someone that I can hold a conversation with, whom I don’t get bored with and whom I can laugh with.

All I can tell you is that, you seem to be doing everything right, maybe you just haven’t found the right person yet, but you will. You just have to keep looking. We can never lose interest in a man who’s good and kind and respectful of us and can take care of himself and keep a good home… that's a complete package!

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A female reader, YouWish United States +, writes (23 April 2014):

YouWish agony auntI don't know if the reasons can be painted by that broad of a brush, because it's a question about society in general, and this being a global site, there's the issue of culture and societal expectations based on race, nationality, and religion. I can give you an answer based on my observations of humanity based on my life as a citizen of the USA, and my esteemed colleagues can give you a UK or Italian perspective, and I'm sure you being Australian means that there are differences in interaction exclusive to your neck of the woods as well.

My observation is that I don't entirely disagree with you. However, women are independent, so it's not a matter of *needing* to find a man to marry and take care of. That and wedding vows not being as binding as they were years ago as well as morals regarding fidelity and conduct. There was a time in the not-too-distant past where adultery was a serious legal offense, and divorce added the element of tort in dealing with the distribution of assets and the care of dependents.

Women don't *have* to be with a guy anymore in our cultures, and I think therein lies the difference. A woman has the ability to vote, hold not only a job, but a meaningful career and education, and is less constrained to act out of gender roles that are antiquated. Thus, women are more choosy who they partner with the older they get. Attraction becomes, for the most part, a much more intelligent issue. In adolescence, the "bad boy" who was the womanizer, substance abuser, lone wolf, reckless outlaw was the one who attracted the women. However, the adult woman's mind is different than the adolescent's romantic tendencies. (there are exceptions!) Now, a man's career, integrity, character, and lack of criminal record mean a lot more. It's not as idealistically romantic to take a guy's credit history into account when it comes to courtship, but we women learn from mistakes.

That's not to say that there aren't women you DON'T learn out there, and that's not to say that guys who were bad boys in their youth don't reform. My father was one -- broke hearts left and right, was married when he met my mother, and she promptly told him to go home and don't talk to her until he was divorced. And that's another thing - women shape ideas of guys consciously or semi-consciously on the role her father played in life. A woman whose father left her learns all too early that she must look out for herself and not to trust men, because the one who should have been trusted the most abandoned her.

Women still love to be loved at any age. Baggage varies, and it does with you as well.

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A male reader, JSBach United Kingdom +, writes (23 April 2014):

The grass is always greener, mate. Having spent twenty years with a needy woman who was totally dependent on me, I have to say I much prefer my independent girlfriend, who wants rather than needs me.

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